this post was submitted on 06 Nov 2024
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No Stupid Questions

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I highly doubt the left will do anything uncivil. How can they win back the country? Is it too late?

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[–] jeena@piefed.jeena.net 151 points 2 weeks ago (6 children)

Democracy is just the tyranny of the majority.

I think that most of the Americans want this, even if people on the outside do not understand. So in that sense they are right now winning back their country, as confusing as it might sound.

[–] Deadlytosty@feddit.nl 101 points 2 weeks ago (12 children)

Normally in Democracy the majority or popular vote wins, however due to the electoral college America has, it doesnt necessarily mean the majority voted for the winner. This was the case for Bush, and some other moments in the past.

[–] rglullis@communick.news 182 points 2 weeks ago (3 children)

FYI: it looks like Trump is going to win the popular vote on this one as well.

[–] Dasus@lemmy.world 166 points 2 weeks ago (11 children)

How in the fuck.

Like what drives a majority of Americans to vote for a demented toddler. It's insane.

As a kid I always wondered how on Earth did Hitler ever make anyone follow himself, how did those people not realise. Turns out a majority of people are just fucking morons.

[–] douglasg14b@lemmy.world 78 points 2 weeks ago* (last edited 2 weeks ago) (2 children)

Yep and the slow gutting of the education system isn't making it any better.

You have an entire generation coming of voting age who are rabid Trump supporters. They don't care about policies or democracy or public institutions. They don't care about healthcare, social securities, or the stability of the economy.

They don't care about any of the things that have been built up through generations. They lack critical thinking ability.

The recipe works. If you make dumb kids they will vote for dumb people. It works so well that part of the future plan for a trump presidency is to get rid of the department of education. Solidifying the Republican party indefinitely.

Without critical thinking and with mass media it's so easy to say every problem that people deal with is because the "other side" made it so. Even if the other side has been doing everything possible to achieve the opposite.

[–] HungryJerboa@lemmy.ca 36 points 2 weeks ago

Americans aren't special. They're just as vulnerable to fascism as anybody else.

The MAGATs might as well be wearing brownshirts and saluting like Mussolini.

[–] Wooki@lemmy.world 10 points 2 weeks ago (1 children)

Blaming young people is up their with blaming immigrants and "gays" ect for [insert topic]. I would be very surprised if this was the case.

I think it's a little more nuanced.

[–] Mora@pawb.social 19 points 2 weeks ago (1 children)

They don't blame young people. They blame lack of education.

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[–] rockerface@lemm.ee 7 points 2 weeks ago

I used to think Ukrainian politicians were fucking clowns. I guess we got outclowned.

[–] yeahiknow3@lemmings.world 6 points 2 weeks ago* (last edited 2 weeks ago) (1 children)

For all practical purposes, about 30% of people are unfeeling morons - basically psychopaths. That’s the number that consistently opposes abortion, for instance. Add to that all the dumbasses who don’t know any better (the undecideds on any extremely obvious moral issue), et voila. That’s how you get slavery, nationalism, genocide, theocracy, you name it.

Unless people are willing to screen for psychopathy and remove it from the gene pool, the human species will keep fucking around until it finds out. Might be nuclear apocalypse or environmental collapse, but at this rate it’s inevitable.

[–] tamal3@lemmy.world 18 points 2 weeks ago (1 children)

Can we please not start arguing in favor of eugenics?

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[–] TranquilTurbulence@lemmy.zip 4 points 2 weeks ago

The rise of the NSDAP has been studied quite a bit. Also, the psychological aspects are really interesting. Basically normal people can make all of this possible as long as the conditions are just right.

[–] natebluehooves@pawb.social 3 points 2 weeks ago (1 children)
[–] skulblaka@sh.itjust.works 2 points 2 weeks ago

Well they're making plenty more of that to go around

[–] silly_crotch@sh.itjust.works 2 points 2 weeks ago

Americans voted in Reagan twice. They also elected Bush twice. This is not surprising.

[–] recently_Coco@lemmy.blahaj.zone 2 points 2 weeks ago

There are many leftists and minorities that have "voted strategically" time and time and time again only for things to get worse and worse.

This kind of disenfranchisement leads to apathy and low turnout.

We are told from a young age that our vote matters, and then when we are older we are told you can only vote for red fascist or blue fascist and many choose not to participate.

There are more who did not vote than who voted for Trump. This is not what the majority wants, but with the system as it is, it is not possible for the majority to voice what they actually genuinely want and have a chance to get it.

The votes do not have to be rigged at the ballot box for voting as a whole system to be rigged.

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[–] s38b35M5@lemmy.world 8 points 2 weeks ago* (last edited 2 weeks ago)

And I was so loving Lina Khan's FTC, ~~asking~~ among other things...

Edit: autocorrect

[–] Jackthelad@lemmy.world 6 points 2 weeks ago (1 children)

And Harris has done worse than Biden in every county in America.

Not every state. Every county.

[–] azertyfun@sh.itjust.works 66 points 2 weeks ago (1 children)

Whether it's 48 or 52 % is an immaterial difference. Every other American who voted, voted for Trump. The rest don't seem to care either way. He has very broad popular assent and is as popular as Harris give or take a margin of error.

Everyone is lasered-focused on the EC because it makes all the difference for the practicalities, but if one is to make a broad judgement of whether Trump won fair and square the answer is "yeah, mostly". Further proof is the fact that the House is probably going to be his as well.

Americans now bear the collective responsibility for the horrors of the next 4(+?) years. Do not make the mistake of blaming the popular will of outright fascism on institutional failures, because institutions didn't force half of Americans to vote for the fascist, again.

[–] Serinus@lemmy.world 8 points 2 weeks ago

I'll wait 72 hours before settling with it, in case any shenanigans were involved. I expect it's legitimate, but I want that window open if it's needed.

[–] Fosheze@lemmy.world 31 points 2 weeks ago (1 children)

Trump is winning the popular vote by a pretty decent margin. The electoral college isn't the issue here.

[–] gerbler@lemmy.world 17 points 2 weeks ago (3 children)

They haven't finished counting that's why. Rural areas are faster to count and skew conservative.

A republican hasn't won the popular vote in 20 years. Trump is projected to win but like last time he'll lose the popular vote and win by virtue of the electoral college.

[–] Fosheze@lemmy.world 30 points 2 weeks ago (1 children)

All the projections I'm seeing him show him almost certainly winning the popular vote. There's a gap of 6 million votes and almost every state is over 90% reported in. That gap is going to likely shrink a bit, but unfortunately it almost certainly won't be enough for him to even lose the popular vote.

Lets face it, we're (assuming you're american) apparently just a country of facists. It looks like GOP is going to have majority in both houses too so here comes project 2025 I guess.

[–] gerbler@lemmy.world 24 points 2 weeks ago

Sorry bud, not a yank. You have my sympathies though.

If it turns out that he does indeed win the popular vote then yeah I'm sorry for your loss. A nest of at least 50% fascists or fascist enablers.

Heart aches for those that did their civic duty and yet have to suffer the repercussions :(

[–] dhork@lemmy.world 13 points 2 weeks ago* (last edited 2 weeks ago) (1 children)

It looks like turnout is way down compared to last election. Trump is pulling about the same amount he did last time ( maybe a few million down, but there are still results to get). Harris is currently down 15M from where Biden was.

Trump's support is no larger than it was last time. Harris' supporters just didn't show up

[–] superkret@feddit.org 12 points 2 weeks ago

Harris’ supporters just didn’t show up

Anyone who didn't show up is not a Harris supporter.

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[–] Omgboom@lemmy.zip 2 points 2 weeks ago

But Trump won the popular vote this time

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[–] Varyk@sh.itjust.works 20 points 2 weeks ago (3 children)

No, there is a concerted effort by conservatives to use voter suppression to subvert the will of the majority in the US.

conservatives are clawing back the country right now by hook and by crook.

can't go on forever, but I don't know which is going to last longer: the country or the aging frightened conservatives willing to subvert democracy to hang on to control.

[–] Seleni@lemmy.world 1 points 2 weeks ago (1 children)

Isn’t just the aging ones sadly. Lots of young people, especially young men, went for Trump. Andrew Tate has taught them well.

[–] Varyk@sh.itjust.works 3 points 2 weeks ago

progressive policies are annually more popular and conservative policies and election results like 2016 and 2024 are won mainly by the old guard funding and utilizing their careful network of voting interference and collusion.

Andrew Tate is a vile exception amongst younger generations, not the rule.

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[–] halcyoncmdr@lemmy.world 19 points 2 weeks ago (2 children)

I think that most of the Americans want this

Maybe, but none of the facts directly support this.

There have been large campaigns to disenfranchise several types of voters for decades in the country. The Electoral College was designed to be unfair to appease Slave states. Voter turnout is abysmal, only about 35% of eligible citizens vote. Out of those turnout is usually around the same percentage. The highest turnout recently was 2020 only because mail in voting was expanded so dramatically, and even then it was only 67% of registered voters, so it was still only 67% of that original 37% of eligible voters. So with the highest recent turnout, we're looking at about 25% of eligible citizens actually voting.

[–] maxwellfire@lemmy.world 4 points 2 weeks ago (1 children)

I believe that the 67% number for the 2020 election is of eligible voters and not registered voters. While turnout is low, it's not 25% low.

[–] billiam0202@lemmy.world 6 points 2 weeks ago

It was ~67% of eligible voters that were registered to vote. Over 94% of registered voters actually voted.

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[–] GrammarPolice@lemmy.world 12 points 2 weeks ago

That's what the Germans thought in 1933

[–] illi@lemm.ee 5 points 2 weeks ago (5 children)

Democracy really is the worst form of government, just not as bad as all the others...

Unfortunately in such polarized times like now, even though majority wants this, the ammount of people for which this is unacceptable is only slightly less than "the majority". And besides, I believe a big part of "the majority" is just gullible enough to be persuaded they want this while it actually goes against their interests

[–] Bonskreeskreeskree@lemmy.world 1 points 2 weeks ago (2 children)

Something can not be the worst and just not as bad as the others.

[–] Hugin@lemmy.world 6 points 2 weeks ago

It's a famous quote. The contradiction is intentional. It means democracy has a lot of problems and often looks terrible. However when you step back and consider the alternatives they are worse.

[–] illi@lemm.ee 4 points 2 weeks ago

Take it up with Winston Churchil - I was just paraphrasing his quote.

The point is democracy is terrible, but we don't have anything better.

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[–] C126@sh.itjust.works 5 points 2 weeks ago

vote against this and save us all from this idiocy.

Nope. There was just more people lined up to vote for more idiocy. We failed the world. I’d say I’m sorry, but I don’t think that’ll help. This is America.

America needs to focus on decentralizing power. That way, when the other side wins, they can't do much damage. Biggest problem America faces is too much centralized control.