Libertarians are much friendlier with conservatives than they are with liberals, however
this post was submitted on 28 May 2024
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I remember, a forum I was part of when I was in my youth had a good number of libertarians. I was on reasonably good terms with a number of them, and thought them genuine, if misguided.
The speed at which they changed their labeling to out-and-out fascists once Trump was elected was... staggering.
That was my experience also. I had a very smart coworker, a scientist, who was libertarian, very anti-police and everything. Then Trump came along and he went full fascist. It was very disturbing, and I haven't trusted libertarians since.
Note: I'm using libertarian as shorthand for libertarian capitalist, which is mostly how it's used in the US, though, as noted in another comment, there are other kinds of libertarians, like libertarian socialists.
Its the same all over. Right-wing "libertarians" are just socially embarrassed corporate statists.
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Would you believe there are libertarian communists? It sounds like a contradiction. Old queer couples should be able to protect their Marijuana plants with guns and pay their taxes for welfare.
Or to be more exact: "LET ME BUILD A FUCKING SHED ON MY OWN LAND. ALSO, STOP TEARING DOWN HOMELESS PEOPLES' TENTS."
All that being said, the libertarian party has taken a horrible turn and I hate being conflated with a guy who had brain worms.
Why do libertarian concerns always sound like loud petty arguments you would hear at the HOA?
I want to be on the side that's NOT on the HOA. What about this sounds like I want to police your yard? I'm advocating for personal freedoms. I'm: Pro choice. Pro Marijuana. Pro mail in vote. Pro welfare. Pro camping. Honestly, fuck you for being unnecessarily dogmatic. There are libertarians out there who DON'T say "lEt tHE StaTEs DecIde."
Well you were yelling about sheds and growing weed. I assume you're waving a gun around as you type. This is like a stereotypical rant at an HOA or city council meeting.
Speaking of which, here's what a town run by libertarians looks like:
It would be hard to wave a gun and type, lol. That's a battle AGAINST HOA and the city council. Also, I don't identify with them. I'm a libertarian communist, not a "red pilled, tech bro, toll roading, anti-choice," libertarian. I've largely denounced my party. I believe in the ideals, not the party. I don't think that's petty. If you do, I don't think you're politically active. That's fine, but you should probably pull your head out of your asshole.
Edit: I noticed you're editing your comments
Edit 2: as rebuttal
Social libertarian is what you are looking for.
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Yes, but the libertarian party of the USA doesn't adhere to the roots of the party. No need to be so hostile, it was an honest question and the fu very much sounds like "get off my lawn!”
I'm drunk, and I'll admit I'm being hostile. Also, fuck lawns. They're a French staple meant to express wealth. They kill pollinators. I just want to build a shed. I like shed.
I'd very much like to learn and talk more with you about the original ideas of libertarianism when you're sober. Back in the late 90s, before the American Libertarians took over the party and changed it, a friend suggested it sounded like a fit for me. I'd also like to know if any other libertarians who are in accord with the original values have an online space for discussion, and any ideas to reclaim the party mechanisms.
There are very few left. I considered myself a social libertarian for a while but I now just don't like political labels. They're terrible for getting a point across.
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Until you get to weed and incarceration
Libertarians being on brand delusional
Such an important distinction I'm sure, as they both file into the ballet box to vote for the Republican nominee.
Ideologically, they’re different, but practically, they’re not.
Again, I didn't vote for Donald Trump last election, but 97% or something of conservatives did,
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Same thing but libertarians are too embarrassed to call themselves conservatives. Or too stupid.
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I can't remember when a Republican candidate sought the Libertarian vote. They must be getting desperate.
Mate, they're going for the Tankie vote. This shit is going down to the wire.
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It's the other way around. There's a lot of overlap with conservatives and big L Libertarians over idealized "rugged individualism" fantasies. Conservatives like it because it's an excuse to continue marginalizing historically marginalized groups, and Libertarians like it because it feeds their ubermensch delusion.
So when conservatism becomes unpopular, a lot of those voters do the big L protest vote, so Republicans messaging to Libertarians is really just Republicans attempting to form ranks, not embiggen the tent.
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Libertarians are republicans who like weed, CMM
They are socially apathetic. To them, they think all social issues and prejudice just magically resolve. They won't necessarily condone the persecution of, say, lgbtq+ or various other minorities... But they also won't lift a finger to stop it either. Their goal is to externalize guilt and responsibility.
Generically corporate-regulation apathetic, too. They think corporations will magically do the right thing, as in not monopolize, pollute, depress wages and benefits, etc.
They want their utopia and modern conveniences but refuse to pay for any of it.
Oh yeah they don't even care about negative market externalities. In their utopia they think corporations in the beeline pursuit of profit will just naturally be compelled
To that I always ask them who would've voluntarily promoted EPA regulations on vehicles or safety regulations in such a society? Automobile manufacturers didn't want to incorporate them as that changes their bottom-line, requires them to re-tool, and raise prices. Consumers didn't want it either because it would again raise prices while those emission devices reduced vehicle power (my grandpa ripped them off in those early years...).
The only people advocating for such things were scientists and health experts who had the foresight to understand the consequences. That then only came from Democratic institutions mandating such requirements.
Libertarians: create a regulation to stop systemic bigotry? No, the Invisible Hand will fix that. Obviously stores that do want those customers will open.
People with functioning brains: looking at history and blinking.
No you see, it's those evil regulations that stifle competition. Monopolies definitely wouldn't form and block out any potential competition.
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And are generally ok with LGBTQIA+, I think it's important to note.
Generally okay with, but are they generally OK with legislation protecting those individuals/recognizing them as protected under the same laws that protect for factors of sex and race?
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Libertarians are mostly pro choice, against restricting gambling, against censorship, against mass government surveillance, against NIMBYism, for gay marriage, and trans rights. Find me a conservative that checks even half of those boxes
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This meme just confused everyone who isn't American or doesn't follow American politics.
Especially since Libertarian as a word and definition of an ideology was co-opted by American anarcho-capitalist Murray Rothbard. Prior to that, libertarian meant freedom of will and general liberty, with some association in anarchism.
Yea, that's what I meant. In the rest of the world libertarian is still a left wing ideology with no connection to ancaps.
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I still don't understand why you USians insist on calling them "conservatives." They're fascists - period.
There might still be some people around in the US you could call conservative with a straight face... but the last time I met one of those online was in 2012. Bernie Sanders is more of a conservative than these fascists are.
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