this post was submitted on 24 Dec 2023
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No Stupid Questions

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[–] DontTreadOnBigfoot@lemmy.world 116 points 11 months ago (2 children)

Yes

Where does the word alphabet come from?

The word alphabet comes from the first two letters of the Greek alphabet: alpha and beta. It was first used, in its Latin form, alphabetum, by Tertullian during the 2nd–3rd century CE and by St. Jerome.

[–] PlantDadManGuy@lemmy.world 55 points 11 months ago (3 children)

I woke up at 7:00 a.m. for this and had a sudden moment of clarity out of absolutely nowhere. Thank you.

[–] gerbler@lemmy.world 15 points 11 months ago

These little epiphanies are always fun. Like when you realise how many maths and astronomy terms are just romanised Arabic words like Algebra and Algorithm.

Another fun one that I wasn't smart enough to notice on my own is that the Hindu-Arabic numerals have the same number of angles in the symbols as the number they represent.

[–] SomeoneElseMod@feddit.uk 5 points 10 months ago

It’s a Christmas miracle! 😉

[–] ook_the_librarian@lemmy.world 4 points 10 months ago

You had a Sudden Clarity Clarence moment, but you don't think in memes.

[–] rynzcycle@kbin.social 14 points 11 months ago

So calling it your ABCs when you're younger isn't that far off. Interesting.

[–] lvxferre@lemmy.ml 65 points 11 months ago (4 children)

Pretty much. English borrowed it from Latin because it's posh. And Latin borrowed it from Greek because it's posh. But at the end of the day it's in the same spirit as "the ABC", or Latin "abecedarius".

[–] modeler@lemmy.world 14 points 11 months ago

And the Greeks took it from the Phoenicians where it was Alep Bet (almost identical to the Hebrew Aleph Beth).

And these are words that start with the sound of the letter. Aleph means Ox and Beth is house.

[–] TheGreenGolem@lemmy.dbzer0.com 11 points 11 months ago

It's also "ABC" ("ábécé") in Hungarian. (And I bet in a lot of other languages too.)

[–] Wilzax@lemmy.world 9 points 11 months ago (3 children)

Then why do Abacuses help us count instead of spell? 🤔

[–] DillyDaily@lemmy.world 6 points 10 months ago

Abacus comes from the Greek "Abak" meaning board or slab.

[–] lvxferre@lemmy.ml 6 points 10 months ago

Coincidence. The word backtracks to Greek ᾰ̓́βᾰξ / ábax "board, slab", it doesn't have to do with ABC.

[–] cone_zombie@lemmy.world 2 points 10 months ago (1 children)
[–] ShortFuse@lemmy.world 8 points 10 months ago (1 children)

It's abecedario in Spanish (ABCDs). I'd imagine the -rio is like diccionario, which is like a collection.

[–] lvxferre@lemmy.ml 7 points 10 months ago

It is kind of the same suffix but the story is a mess.

That -ario and all words using it are reborrowed* from Latin. And originally it was two related suffixes, fulfilling two purposes:

  • masculine -arius, feminine -aria: transform noun into adjective. Like "a be ce de" (ABCD) into "abecedarius" (alphabetic).
  • neuter -arium: noun denoting a place for another noun. Like "dictio" (saying) into "dictionarium" (dictionary, or "where you store sayings")

Except that Latin allowed you to use an adjective as if it was a noun (Spanish still does it), so that "abecedarius" ended as a substantive again. And Spanish merged Latin masculine and neuter, further conflating both versions of the suffix.

*the inherited doublet is the -ero in llavero (place for keys) and herrero (related to iron - professions took the suffix and systematised the re-substantivisation).

[–] pmk@lemmy.sdf.org 51 points 11 months ago

Similarly, the viking rune "alphabet" is called the Futhark, because the first letters are pronounced F, U, Þ, A, R, K.

[–] QubaXR@lemmy.world 36 points 11 months ago (2 children)

Fun fact - in Polish language the word alfabet exists as a technical name of the alphabet. There is also a more casual word, often used by children: abecadło which is basically polish way of saying "The ABCs".

[–] teft@startrek.website 22 points 11 months ago (3 children)

Spanish is similar. For spanish the word is abecedario.

[–] voidMainVoid@lemmy.world 7 points 11 months ago

English has "abecedarian", which can mean "alphabetical", "rudimentary", "elementary", "novice" or "beginner".

[–] sneezycat@sopuli.xyz 1 points 11 months ago

We also have alfabeto though.

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[–] voidMainVoid@lemmy.world 8 points 11 months ago (1 children)

The Latin word is "abecedarium". I don't know why English adopted the Greek word.

[–] hddsx@lemmy.ca 4 points 11 months ago (1 children)

I mean, English isn’t a Romance language

[–] voidMainVoid@lemmy.world 1 points 11 months ago

True, but it does have a lot of Latinate words.

[–] Anticorp@lemmy.ml 28 points 10 months ago (1 children)

Wow, I can't believe I never put that together before.

[–] TheBig2023Meltdown@lemmy.world 7 points 10 months ago

Shower thought material right there

[–] MrSilkworm@lemmy.world 26 points 11 months ago* (last edited 11 months ago)

yes.

source: can speak Greek.

Also the first two letters of the Greek alphabet are άλφα (alpha) and βήτα (beta)

[–] humorlessrepost@lemmy.world 23 points 11 months ago

Not that different from us talking about “learning our ABCs”.

[–] Resol@lemmy.world 17 points 11 months ago (1 children)

If it isn't, then where else would the word "alphabet" come from?

Oh wait, you could look at the Hebrew alphabet and pretend that the word came from its first two letters: Aleph and Bet.

[–] pohart@programming.dev 6 points 11 months ago (2 children)

This is what I thought. From Hebrew.

[–] NoMoreLurking@startrek.website 15 points 11 months ago (1 children)
[–] Deceptichum@kbin.social 9 points 11 months ago* (last edited 11 months ago)

From Egyptian Hieroglyphs actually.

Which the Phoenicians turned into letters, which eventually became our letters.

Look, A is a lil upside down cows head hieroglyph.

[–] Resol@lemmy.world 3 points 11 months ago (1 children)

In all honesty, I don't know which of the two languages is older.

[–] astraeus@programming.dev 4 points 11 months ago (1 children)

Hebrew is slightly older than Greek but it was also more isolated than Greek and likely did not have much influence on Greek. As another commenter pointed out, Phoenician is the accepted source for the Greek alphabet.

[–] Resol@lemmy.world 1 points 10 months ago

I guess that answers that.

[–] Wilzax@lemmy.world 15 points 11 months ago (1 children)

No, it's a noun made from the portmanteau of the first two letters of the greek alphabet

[–] actionjbone@sh.itjust.works 5 points 11 months ago (1 children)
[–] deadbeef79000@lemmy.nz 4 points 11 months ago

The best kind of correct.

[–] username_unavailable@lemmy.world 13 points 11 months ago (1 children)

There's a series on Prime via The Great Courses Collection about the origins of language. (Almost?) all languages derive their names like this, but that's like, a throw away line in a much deeper series.

[–] emergencyfood@sh.itjust.works 4 points 11 months ago

Many Indian languages use some version of 'akshara', which means 'unchanging' or 'indestructible'. (I guess the alphabet does change, but too slowly for us to notice.) Most Indian languages start the alphabet with all the vowels, so 'first n letters' would be unpronouncable.

[–] angrystego@lemmy.world 13 points 10 months ago

Azbuka, name of the cirillic script, also comes from the old names of the first two letters.

[–] bionicjoey@lemmy.ca 11 points 11 months ago
[–] UziBobuzi@kbin.social 8 points 11 months ago
[–] casmael@startrek.website 8 points 11 months ago
[–] tygerprints@kbin.social 7 points 11 months ago

I never thought of it before, but it is a conjunction of those first two Greek letters. Or else, it's named after the soup it resembles.

[–] CarlsIII@kbin.social 7 points 11 months ago (1 children)

No, it’s named after the cereal

[–] No_Ones_Slick_Like_Gaston@lemmy.world 5 points 11 months ago (3 children)

Completely wrong as is clearly named after Google parent company Alphabet

[–] takeda@lemmy.world 1 points 11 months ago

Yeah. Little known fact, they named their company after their original product, but struggled with how to turn in profit, so they created a Google subsidiary which invented a search engine. True story.

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[–] takeda@lemmy.world 6 points 11 months ago

Sounds like a question asked by someone who already knows the answer.

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