this post was submitted on 28 Jun 2024
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[–] Allonzee@lemmy.world 235 points 5 months ago* (last edited 5 months ago) (103 children)

I don't like Joe Biden, I'll never forget the Neoliberal bullshit he did with the Republicans in the 90s we are still suffering from further eviscerating the safetynet to the draconian war on people suffering addiction. He's one of the OG former opposition party members the Reagan Revolution convinced to take the bigger bribe checks from Wall Street than Unions could ever match, today's neoliberal(D) party.

That said, I voted for him in the last election, and I will again out of harm reduction. He has improved on policy, but l even if he didn't, the American people do not get a vote on whether or not to elect a senile President this cycle.

You can have any President you like, as long as he's senile. If you vote, we'll get a senile President. If you don't, we'll get a senile President.

The question is whether you want senile and gleefully cruel(R), or just senile(D). I'll take just senile.

[–] Objection@lemmy.ml 19 points 5 months ago

the American people do not get a vote on whether or not to elect a senile President this cycle

I feel like I've somehow become trapped in some kind of simulation or thought experiment where the purpose of it is to make lesser evilism seem as ridiculous as conceivably possible, and every time I think it's peaked with just comical levels of absurdity, it somehow manages to escalate.

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[–] JoMiran@lemmy.ml 184 points 5 months ago (8 children)

I am not going to vote for Joe Biden. I am going to vote for the Biden Administration. They can "Weekend at Bernie's" the old man for all I care.

[–] PhlubbaDubba@lemm.ee 34 points 5 months ago* (last edited 5 months ago) (1 children)

Biden could drop dead on January 21st and we'll still get to call this mission accomplished, VP Jeffries ain't a half bad outcome personally, although Kamala having her eyes on that incumbent effect is gonna make me groan come 28

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[–] psmgx@lemmy.world 22 points 5 months ago

That's been the standard US Presidential SOP since Nixon developed a serious drinking problem and Kissinger demanded all orders go through him first (so as to avoid WW3).

They had an old, dementia ridden actor, and the dumb-ass Bush son for that reason, too. HW Bush could handle his shit but he raised taxes and puked on the Japanese PM so that's a pass. Trump is just another stooge to be kept in line so that his doners get what they want.

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[–] eran_morad@lemmy.world 126 points 5 months ago (2 children)

Biden shit the bed and should fuck off. But I’d vote for his corpse over any filthy republican traitor.

[–] RagingRobot@lemmy.world 25 points 5 months ago (8 children)

Both candidates would be more attractive to me if they died actually lol I wish we had the option to just skip having a president for 4 years haha

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[–] Weirdfish@lemmy.world 114 points 5 months ago (4 children)

So the man has a stutter, and he's old, what ever. All I can do is cast my single vote. Last time, I voted against Trump, and honestly, even after the debate, I'll cast my vote this time for Biden.

I'd much rather cast my vote for Hakeem Jeffries, or Shift, or Bernie, or a dozen other people who aren't an option.

Thing is, I'm going to cast my vote in Cook county IL, so it literally won't matter. IL is going blue no matter what, and I feel like my participation is merely token.

I wish I could do more, I want to scream at clouds about what is happening to the country, and it doesn't matter.

Saw a stat that says Trump is 65% to win, and want to physically grab people and shake them, but what would it matter?

Had I walked into that debate blind, not knowing who those people are, what the "facts" and the facts are, I'd have thought, that Biden guy seems weak and befuddled, and boy that Trump is sure a confident leader. It made me feel sick.

As I told my mother today, I don't have kids, I live in the midwest, have a good job with a big stable company, truth is, even a second Trump term won't effect me that much. I can just sit back, enjoy my 30 so years left, and watch the world burn, but damn it, I have empathy for others, and there are many, many people whose lives and livelihood are going to be seriously impacted, and that bothers me.

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[–] StinkySocialist@lemmy.ml 93 points 5 months ago (54 children)

This Biden protection is crazy. we need a candidate who actually stands a chance against Trump. this is insane. It's 2016 all over again.

[–] AnUnusualRelic@lemmy.world 45 points 5 months ago (3 children)

I don't even see why that matters. Even if the candidate was an actual real turnip, the choice would be obvious.

I mean I don't vote in your election but it seems quite clear to me.

[–] StinkySocialist@lemmy.ml 24 points 5 months ago (11 children)

I think part of our different view might be based on how our electoral system is.

So to explain: Trump's never won a popular election before. Even when he became president, most Americans voted for his opposition Hillary Clinton. We have a very gerrymandered and corrupt voting system to oversimplify. Because of that The main decider for presidential elections is voting turnout. If a lot of people come out to vote, the Democrats usually win. If they don't the Republicans win. Voter turnout is higher when people want to vote for the Democratic nominee. No one really wants to vote for Biden. Most of us will vote against Trump myself included. That being said, if we run a very unlikable candidate against him like we did in 2016, he might win and that's terrifying. This election is serious so we should take it seriously and run somebody likeable and not half way to being a turnip.

God forbid if Biden stays in there, I hope he wins. I'll even vote for him but I am not feeling good about his odds.

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[–] Desistance@lemmy.world 24 points 5 months ago* (last edited 5 months ago) (10 children)

I'm not voting for the insurrectionist in 2024. I don't care how frail Biden looks. The choice is obvious. I'll worry about the next candidate.

[–] StinkySocialist@lemmy.ml 27 points 5 months ago (1 children)

No one Is suggesting you should vote for Trump and his fascist. I'm saying I'm worried Biden won't beat Trump and his fascist in an election because he's not a strong candidate at all. This is the same problem we have with Hillary in 2016

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[–] HawlSera@lemm.ee 21 points 5 months ago

Hey it worked out well when they protected Hillary.....

Wait no it didn't

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[–] Objection@lemmy.ml 68 points 5 months ago (17 children)

raspy voice

The gaslighting will continue until morale improves.

[–] Marcbmann@lemmy.world 29 points 5 months ago (1 children)

The people here are either delusional or trying to convince themselves they didn't see a disaster of a debate.

"So he didn't somersault onto stage" That... That's not the issue here

[–] Objection@lemmy.ml 35 points 5 months ago (7 children)

Legitimately I can't tell how much of it is self-delusion and how much is just blatant lying. Either way, these geriatric ghouls don't deserve this level of mental gymnastics.

Even liberal media like the NYT are admitting it, and we can all see him with our eyes, I don't see what this sort of blatant denialism is supposed to accomplish other than demonstrating in-group loyalty.

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[–] givesomefucks@lemmy.world 68 points 5 months ago (37 children)

People aren't even giving him crediting for beating Medicare!

/s

In all seriousness though, I just can't understand how someone can watch the 2020 debate and 2024 debate, and say the only thing wrong with Biden was his voice...

Like, he wasn't great in 2020, but 2024 made it sound like Obama in comparison.

[–] SkyezOpen@lemmy.world 32 points 5 months ago (4 children)

The worst part is he was coherent afterwards. The fuck happened.

[–] elgordino@fedia.io 60 points 5 months ago (2 children)

I think he was massively over coached. Trying to fight to remember a ton of talking points and then getting them muddled up and stuck in that detail. He’d have been better off just freestyling it.

[–] SkyezOpen@lemmy.world 27 points 5 months ago

Seriously he just needed one or two dark brandon moments to get trump on tilt and it's smooth sailing from there. Oh well. I'll enjoy the dem campaign managers running around with their hair on fire while I can. They should've managed someone else into the spotlight years ago.

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[–] Icalasari@fedia.io 26 points 5 months ago (7 children)

My bet is that Trump's stream of bullshit just threw Biden off completely, and his quick recovery to that fiery speech was him getting pissed that he got curbstomped by Shitler in a debate

Next debate should hopefully be VERY different

[–] SkyezOpen@lemmy.world 22 points 5 months ago (2 children)

No way should it have. In fact that should have been the literal one thing they were expecting.

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[–] theacharnian@lemmy.ca 55 points 5 months ago (3 children)

RBG, Feinstein, now Biden. Selfish geriatric boomers should learn when to retire.

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[–] Mastengwe@lemm.ee 54 points 5 months ago (14 children)

It’s good to see common sense in here. While Biden did not make a good show- the fact remains that he is up against a convicted felon and a fascist traitor to his country.

I’m glad to see reason in most of the responses.

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[–] pyre@lemmy.world 53 points 5 months ago (19 children)

most important thing is that he can still use his arm to sign legislation. that's all you need him for. the actual deal is the cabinet. that's what you're voting for.

too bad most people don't think about that, and fuck the dnc for putting the country in this situation.

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[–] pjwestin@lemmy.world 51 points 5 months ago* (last edited 5 months ago) (8 children)

No. Just no, dude. 64% of Democrats thought he was too old to run, and the party didn't even hold a primary. Then he walks out for his first debate and gives an incoherent performance that completely validates everyone's fears about his age, and you want to play it off with a, "bUt HeR eMaiLs!" meme? Screw that. We shouldn't be trying to convince people they didn't see what they saw, we should be figuring out how to get him off the fucking ticket.

[–] lolcatnip@reddthat.com 32 points 5 months ago (17 children)

Why does nobody ever talk about how Trump is too old to run?

[–] PugJesus@lemmy.world 22 points 5 months ago (7 children)

Because that doesn't help Trump get elected.

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[–] OccamsTeapot@lemmy.world 19 points 5 months ago

Trump could be the youngest presidential candidate in history and he would still be essentially just as bad. Possibly even worse. If Biden didn't have these excruciating moments where he seems super senior and gets incoherent he would be pretty good. Unless you happen to be a Palestinian obvs.

Anyway, people have higher standards for Biden and THEY SHOULD.

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[–] HaleHirsute@infosec.pub 28 points 5 months ago

Fucking exactly, amen. Biden couldn’t make any sense. Trump should be in jail, and Biden needs to be replaced on the dem ticket asap.

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[–] Zehzin@lemmy.world 30 points 5 months ago* (last edited 5 months ago) (7 children)

Sure, let's all pretend the problem was his voice. Ignoring all problems will do wonders in november.

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[–] Yawweee877h444@lemmy.world 28 points 5 months ago (14 children)

We should all be screaming at the top of our lungs for Biden to drop out now. Fast. Throw in Newsom or Whitmer. I'll vote for either, doesn't matter.

This is a no brainer, and no loss. Either they do it which would be great, or we're stuck with biden anyway, who now looks to be much worse off against trump.

Everyone should be telling biden to drop out. Everyone everyone everyone. And loudly.

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[–] Linkerbaan@lemmy.world 26 points 5 months ago (6 children)

Full senile moment = "raspy voice"

Biden apologists are gonna be the reason Trump gets elected.

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[–] Snapz@lemmy.world 23 points 5 months ago (4 children)

This whole night was so many layers of exhausting, but probably not for the reasons you think... No rational, serious person was expecting Biden to Willy Wonka front somersault into this debate? it was going to be what this was, the only true surprise was probably the volume of his voice (which they chalk up to a cold, okay fine, I guess) and actually how well he did quickly processing and responding to trump's gish gallop and unchecked stream of consciousness mistruth firehose with little help from the impotent moderators for the majority of the night.

The people in this country, in their immediate reaction to this debate, demonstrate that they just fundamentally lack the focus, empathv and frankly basic intelligence to process the substance of this or any debate. On average, we respond solely to voice pitch, tonality, body language and facial expressions, like a still developing toddler... Or a dog.

[–] ryathal@sh.itjust.works 19 points 5 months ago (14 children)

Volume is a minor issue, the problem was the half finished thoughts and odd transitions between them.

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[–] HawlSera@lemm.ee 22 points 5 months ago* (last edited 5 months ago)

I have no faith in the future and only pray death is swift and merciful. I will vote Biden in hopes of delaying the inevitable another four years.

I was hoping that the Right's march into fascism was going to be the call to action that Americans needed to abandon them and push the country into being a proper developed nation....

Instead, people go along with it to own the libs, and the privileged who know better have the resources to stamp their foot and wait for a savior they should know will never come.

[–] simplejack@lemmy.world 20 points 5 months ago

It wasn’t so much the voice that was the problem, it’s that his answers were often bad and totally incoherent.

If he was clear and concise, I’d deal with the raspy voice.

[–] fireweed@lemmy.world 18 points 5 months ago* (last edited 5 months ago) (1 children)

Except he didn't just have a raspy voice. He was mixing up words, rambling, even struggling to put full sentences together at points. And when he wasn't talking he looked to be spacing out at times, just trying to hold it together at others. His performance was as if he was fighting a very high fever, a migraine, and/or was trying not to puke the entire debate. I totally believe reports that he had a minor illness and was having an off day as a result, but unless he had something like the flu (in which case he wouldn't have been allowed on stage, certainly not that close to Trump) it would be completely reasonable to expect him to perform much better even while sick.

I think that matters to voters, because as president you don't get to take a sick day; shit goes down and you need to be there for it. Maybe he's not too old to be president on days when he's feeling well, but I think a lot of viewers last night thought he looked completely incapable of handling any kind of sudden crisis in his condition last night.

Obligatory: assuming he's still the nominee I'm voting for Biden in November anyway because all the alternatives suck more.

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