this post was submitted on 02 Feb 2024
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More video and eyewitness info on Al Jazeera so far

Also reported on Common Dreams and Middle East Eye.

I haven't found any reports of any independent investigations yet, hopefully they are underway

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[–] WaxedWookie@lemmy.world 83 points 9 months ago (137 children)

A question for the genocide deniers that'll pop into this thread to spout their monstrous nonsense...

Can you point to a way in which the actions, policies, or rhetoric of the Israeli government meaningfully differs from those of Novemberpogrome-era (Krystalnacht-era) Nazi Germany?

This isn't pointed at any individual, so I'm not even putting you on the spot - this is an opportunity for you to bring your best answers.

[–] okamiueru@lemmy.world 47 points 9 months ago (1 children)

Can you point to a way in which the actions, policies, or rhetoric of the Israeli government meaningfully differs from those of Novemberpogrome-era (Krystalnacht-era) Nazi Germany?

They spoke German.

[–] WaxedWookie@lemmy.world 16 points 9 months ago (1 children)

Well that... that... that changes everything!

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[–] ModernRisk@lemmy.dbzer0.com 33 points 9 months ago (2 children)

I have realized a while ago that there’s no point in arguing or discussing with genocide-deniers, pro-Israel and pro-zionists.

They will write the most delusional things, deny every evidence there’s and come up with the most delusional things to defend the Israeli-Government.

[–] WaxedWookie@lemmy.world 13 points 9 months ago

I think they're delusional enough that there's value in giving them the space to lay that delusion out for all to see. They're one of the best arguments against themselves.

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[–] kromem@lemmy.world 15 points 9 months ago* (last edited 9 months ago) (1 children)

If you are asking for a devil's advocate argument, we could start with the fact that the Jews weren't exactly known for detaining, torturing, and mass executing their own.

Hamas in 2014 allegedly tortured and killed 23 Palestinians under the cover of the Gaza conflict then by Amnesty.

That's not the only time they've executed Palestinians for alleged "collaboration."

You also have the fact that the Jews didn't torture and kill hundreds of German civilians including women and infants to kick off a retaliation.

While I think Likud show a disguising disregard for civilian life and suspect a number of their party would like to carry out a one sided genocide, I also think the "it's the same thing as the Holocaust" is a pretty gross statement.

It's also probably prudent to not jump to conclusions in what's actually taking place during the fog of war. I strongly suspect Israel is committing war crimes under the current administration, but I also remember the 2008 Goldstone report where they were accused of doing so after not participating in the process at all and then years later the person spearheading that inquiry said that had they known at the time the information they learned since, they would have had a different position towards the Israeli operations.

Time has a way of revealing a lot of details that are lost in the moment, there's probably unprecedented propaganda on both sides of this conflict, and while we should err on the side of humanitarian concerns in directing foreign policy and negotiations, the process of investigating allegations is extremely important.

But to be frank, the knee jerk "this is identical to Nazi Germany killing the Jews" is ignorant as shit. You can't just ignore the existence of Hamas and the fact it controls the region with its own war crimes (which, as has been the case for ISIS/ISIL and al-Queda, are often directed at their own dissidents with greater scope and violence than foreigners).

[–] hydroxide@lemmy.ml 5 points 9 months ago* (last edited 9 months ago) (8 children)

If you're going to play devil's advocate at least know the facts. There WERE Jewish militant groups that resisted the Nazis. The oppressed are justified to fight back.

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Warsaw_Ghetto_Uprising

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[–] Linkerbaan@lemmy.world 64 points 9 months ago* (last edited 9 months ago) (2 children)

Some of the victims were blindfolded with their hands tied behind their backs with zip ties.

There were witness statements of mass executions committed by the IDF 2 weeks ago, now actual evidence is found and being shown.

[–] assassin_aragorn@lemmy.world 18 points 9 months ago

With how often we spar, I feel it's worth mentioning that I fully agree with you here. There's enough substantial evidence. This is horrific.

Between this and the IDF disguising itself as civilians and doctors to kill targets in a hospital, it's fairly clear that the organization needs to completely disband as part of any peace agreement.

[–] HappycamperNZ@lemmy.world 9 points 9 months ago* (last edited 9 months ago) (1 children)

Looked into the presenter of this video (Middle East Eye)

  • heavy Palestine bias

  • owners not known

  • 0 Israeli perspective

  • (edit after chatting with poster - two week old video edited for this event)

I've gone through the last 8 hours of Al Jazeera links - no mention of this article. The review from the last 24 hours does not mention this link. Do you have an Al Jazeera, BBC, or AP link to this video, because right now it looks fabricated with the AJ logo.

The AJ link you posted is a great article- bodies found, likely bound and executed, investigating ongoing, Palestine blames Israel.

[–] Linkerbaan@lemmy.world 6 points 9 months ago (7 children)

I checked and it seems like they reposed a 2 weeks old AJ video cutting out some of their footage.

https://youtu.be/E4PtbgpBu9E

So it's less recent than I thought, but still relevant. First witness statements of mass IDF executions were ~2 months ago iirc (don't quote me on that I might be 2 weeks off)

Mee is a respectable news source. One sided for sure but they're not making stuff up.

Israel doesn't get covered much on the Arab side, they're afraid to quote lies from the IDF and tarnish their reputation of factually being factual. Unlike mostly western propaganda outlets like NYT which will happily verbatim quote every lie the IDF tells them even when it's already debunked. 40 beheaded hospital tunnels. You know the drill.

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[–] Stamets@lemmy.world 52 points 9 months ago* (last edited 9 months ago)

The country genociding people have to make mass graves from executing civilians? Say it ain't so.

[–] badbytes@lemmy.world 36 points 9 months ago (5 children)

Store all this data to tell accurate histories.

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[–] Burn_The_Right@lemmy.world 34 points 9 months ago

When people try to tell you conservatives (including neoliberals) aren't that bad, just point to this genocide.

[–] white_shotgun@aussie.zone 33 points 9 months ago (1 children)

Israel is committing genocide it's plain to see and the world watches on....

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[–] normalexit@lemmy.world 30 points 9 months ago

It's sad, it's an atrocity, it's unsurprising.

[–] mlg@lemmy.world 30 points 9 months ago (1 children)

A lot of this really mirroring the Bosnian genocide which was only 25 years ago

[–] phoneymouse@lemmy.world 16 points 9 months ago

Mirroring the f*cking holocaust

[–] middlemanSI@lemmy.world 10 points 9 months ago (1 children)

The fact this is still news in 2024 is beyond stupid.

[–] fastandcurious@lemmy.world 28 points 9 months ago (1 children)

This has been going on for almost 70yrs, it’s just that they have now acknowledged and embraced it as well

[–] Sunforged@lemmy.ml 12 points 9 months ago (4 children)

Netanyahu wasin dire straights when this kicked off. War is good for those in power, shit is extremely reminiscent to Bush's position before 9/11. Of course it's being embraced.

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[–] platypus_plumba@lemmy.world 6 points 9 months ago

This is no longer shocking.

[–] WaxedWookie@lemmy.world 6 points 9 months ago

Right? No human could possibly find genocide to be abhorrent - it must be the bots.

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