Fuck this strawman, every single (voting age) gen z person i know has already talked about voting in this election. Even if it’s just voting for “not trump”. When one candidate is actively claiming they will operate as a dictator “day one”, you have a lot of incentive to vote. Especially when you haven’t already been living with crushed dreams for decades.
this post was submitted on 17 Jan 2024
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Refusing to vote for an imperfect candidate in order to stop a fascist takeover doesn't sound very smart. "We can't have our specialest most perfectest prezzy so lol get fukked every1."
Neither does ignoring their concerns and saying they should just vote for Biden because he's not trump.
It's true, and they should.
But we have literal decades of evidence showing that "what are you going to do, vote Republican ?" Is a bad strategy and if we want engagement we need to actually do things or at least try
Think of it this way
By the next election one choice isn't eligible anymore, and the second will likely be so buried under court cases he won't be able to.
So it's more of a "finish what was started" and hopefully by the next election we'll finally have some new people to worry about.
4 years is a long time...
And we literally just used that excuse 4 years ago and are going to have the exact two candidates...
And history shows we'll likely still have to pick between two elderly out of touch white men in another four years.
One will probably be actually evil again, and the other will likely think changing anything is too rash of a decision and things are changing to fast already.
The entire point of running for office is getting people to vote for you, that's why the party places so much importance on large corporate donations.
But when a moderate candidate can't get voters energized because they're too pro business and won't help Americans, suddenly it's the Americans fault.
Maybe we should re-evalute if "bringing millions from corporations and billionaires" is really more important in a candidate than "people like this person and want to vote for them".
We keep running historically unpopular candidates in the general and then getting mad they're not popular with voters.
Why keep doing it over and over again?
Why keep doing it over and over again?
Because these corrupt politicians deliver big time for their donors. For recent examples, just look at the massive $2 trillion in tax cuts for the rich and corporations Trump passed. That was pretty much his only legislative accomplishment. And then Biden made those cuts permanent. (Ok, not exactly, he raised them back up a small amount by closing a couple loopholes but not close to what they were pre-trump).
If the established power structure won’t allow outsiders to run, and the donors always get what they want, I ask this question instead:
Why would things ever change from here?
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The issue is that Gen Z has clocked onto "to what end?" The GOP is going to run a fascist in every presidential election for at least the next decade, maybe until the party collapses. This is the second election in a row where Gen Z has had to "suck it up because democracy is at stake." They're not idiots, they have a strong suspicion that they'll be told to suck it up again in the election after. Is it any surprise that they're not interested in a system that has told them to shut up and do as they're told?
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The problem is, I'm almost 40 and have been hearing this my whole life. And the Democrats keep moving further right.
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As a Canadian philosopher once noted:
If you choose not to decide, you still have made a choice!
Let me know once it's time to start keeping things equal with hatchet, axe, and saw.
“The logic of not voting for Joe Biden in 2024 is that the Democratic Party is supposed to be accountable to young people and diverse communities.”
Such an adorable take. I used to think they were accountable, too. That they gave a shit what I thought and would do things that I approved of, or have a good reason not to. That voting actually sent a message.
Give this kid another decade and he'll be as hopeless as I am.
Then there's this guy:
“[I’ll say], ‘Hey, you want to buy a house after college, right? You want to have a good-paying job after you graduate, right? You want to be able to have access to health care?”
I really don't think voting is the best way to get these things. Especially when Democrats never talk about access to health care, just health "coverage."
What voting for Biden will get you is more boring government. That's about the only thing voting will get you that you actually want.
This kid actually gets it:
And then there’s the Electoral College. For Lillian, it’s difficult to feel like her vote matters in a state that has gone blue since 1980 and a rural county that generally swings red. "The whole [voting] thing is a symbolic gesture,” she says. “If we had a more direct voting system, I would participate more. The Electoral College is scum.”
Want people to think voting matters? Make their vote actually matter. Outside of swing states votes for president just become meaningless statistics, especially since you don't need the popular vote to win the election.
Will the silence be loud enough to create actual change in how the Democratic Party approaches the youth vote in future elections[?]
It never has been, and it never will be.
Dems not talking about healthcare is kinda not true is it? The US has the ACA and coverage means expanding who has access to the ACA and at what tarrifs.
The ACA was supposed to have a public option. But the health insurance companies got Lieberman to kill that. Now whenever I hear a Democratic politician talk about health care it’s about making sure everyone has “coverage.”
Pay very close attention when you hear them talking and you’ll hear it. But people don’t need health insurance, they need health care. And the coverage Dems keep pitching often gets between people and care.
But the health insurance companies got Lieberman to kill that.
It was designed to be jettisoned from the beginning. Lieberman was just the rotating villain at the time.
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Oh look, more "everybody's doin' it" propaganda
And thus democracy will die
I don’t believe the kids will abandon their own future but human are dumb as. Fuck when it comes to emotional decision making so who can say
It isn't just Gen Z. My own parents are tired of the bullshit, lesser of two complete won't do fuck all for Americans and are talking about opting out of 2024 because they don't want an old guy doing not a lot of them in middle America but don't want to vote for a criminal racist either.
That was a fun conversation about how you don't have to like the old guy, I don't really either, but fuck me if you'll roll over and let a literal fucking Nazi in the office by not voting for ineffective.
The inability to move the needle on student loan forgiveness and school shootings is going to hurt him to some degree.
But at the same time, it's not like Trump is going to even ATTEMPT to do anything about student loans or school shootings.
We need to be clear with non-voters, the issues that are driving you to sit out are not the issues you should be worried about.
Joe Biden is selling weapons to Israel! Yes, weapons they don't actually need to commit the war crimes they are committing.
Meanwhile Trump:
https://www.cnn.com/2022/10/16/politics/trump-american-jews-israel/index.html
"No President has done more for Israel than I have."
Here's what you should be worried about:
Clarence Thomas and Samuel Alito are both well past retirement age. Trump could very well ask them to step down so he can appoint someone younger.
He already did that with Justice Kennedy.
https://www.vanityfair.com/news/2018/06/donald-trump-justice-anthony-kennedy-retirement
That would give Trump 5 picks on the Supreme Court and lock in a dystopian nightmare of rulings for the rest of our lives.
How has he been unable to move the needle on student loan forgiveness when substantial amount of loans have already been forgiven and more are in the works? Not being able to forgive 100% of them counts as being 100% unable to do any of it?
This is only the most recent one
the only way that effort will continue is if Biden or another Dem is in office because there’s no way the GOP will help.
You’re absolutely right, a LOT of Biden’s wins people act like it didn’t happen, and if it did and wasn’t exactly what they hoped for it’s trash, etc.
Conservatives can do no wrong to their base, but dems must be perfection or they’re just as bad to a lot of d voters
Pretty much. They’ve been litigating the issue and doing what they can within the constraints they have, but apparently it amounts to nothing to entitled people.
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If you don't vote, you may lose the opportunity next time. Fascists don't exactly like democratic voting systems.
Politics is messy. This just sounds like a bunch of over-privileged naive people who are afraid to get their hands a little dirty.
Your vote isn't a valentine, it's a chess move.
I blame the whole “voting changes things” culture. We tell kids that voting and politics means something and then when they learn how it actually works they get disheartened.
If we lower their expectations I bet they would vote more. Drop the idea that government will be responsive and filled with intelligent statesmen. Forget about any sort of relief or change. Vote for the one who will make politics boring. Vote because these idiots don't know anything and couldn't govern their way out of a paper bag.
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There's a Gen Z kid that I was talking to who said she liked Trump because he's so funny and crazy, and that was literally as much as she knew about him, just the stupid antics. I was horrified, like, "You've got to be kidding?" I hope I did a good job explaining how bad he was for the country, but sometimes I wonder about the kids today. Get off my lawn.
I'd vote for President Dwayne Elizondo Mountain Dew Camacho. He seems like a fun guy!
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As a leftist, it's important to accept that the Dems will never, ever, ever move to the left unless there's massive grassroots organization such as Unionization and Socialists winning local elections.
People who abstain from voting as protest, however, still think ironically that voting is anything other than loss prevention. If everyone sits out and protests, literally everyone on the Dem side and Trump wins in a landslide, and Trump manages to keep elections for 2028, the Dems still won't move to the left.
That's why voting as a leftist is about loss prevention, rather than gaining material change. The movement leftward comes from upsetting the entire 2 party process by flipping the table itself. Mass Unionization and taking of key seats is exactly how you (non-violently) upset the process and force concessions or enable third party to be theoretically viable.
Until then, however, any leftist not voting Dem in the federal election is sorely misguided.
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I wonder what billionaire feudalism propaganda servitor ordered this article written? Someone from the WalMart clan? Koch Bros? Who?
And them not seeing that having the right to even abstain is at threat.There may not be another election next time.
I guess it's just easier to blame the boomers for the state the country is in, comparing to bothersome things like exercising your right to choose. Kids. Go figure.
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