this post was submitted on 16 Jan 2024

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submitted 9 months ago by any_memes_necessary@lemmy.world to c/politicalmemes@lemmy.world

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[–] AllonzeeLV@lemmy.world 114 points 9 months ago* (last edited 9 months ago) (1 children)

Right?

"people wait for MONTHS for non-emergent surgeries in places with universal healthcare"

You mean exactly like how the doctors here schedule grandma's knee replacement for May in January?

There is no non-luxury millionaire concierge medicine plan eventuality here in the US where someone complains about chronic pain, gets a diagnosis that isn't life threatening, and has the doctor pencil in their chronic pain addressing surgery for that afternoon.

Just another empty strawman explicitly made to derail the conversation.

[–] JasonDJ@lemmy.zip 8 points 9 months ago

Dude a millionaire isn’t even rich anymore. Any boomer who bought and paid off their house since the 80s-90s in a halfway populated area is most the way there just in home equity alone.

[–] gedaliyah@lemmy.world 105 points 9 months ago* (last edited 9 months ago) (4 children)

The arguments about "inefficiency" and "bureaucracy" have to be the most baffling ones to me. We already have a system that is an inefficient maze of red tape, lengthy forms, and arbitrary decisions about healthcare availability made by suits without medical training. We already pay high premiums. What "efficiencies" of capitalist healthcare are we so desperate to preserve?

[–] nova_ad_vitum@lemmy.ca 79 points 9 months ago (1 children)

Every single dollar earned in profit by a health insurance company is a dollar that was spent on healthcare, for which no healthcare was delivered. And there are billions of them.

Health insurance company profits are literally inefficiency in the system.

[–] ChickenLadyLovesLife@lemmy.world 9 points 9 months ago

Health insurance company profits are literally inefficiency in the system.

And an absolutely staggering inefficiency at that. The US spends roughly twice as much per capita as the rest of the developed world for healthcare, for health outcomes that are ranked nowhere near the top. A 100% inefficiency, attributable entirely to private health insurance.

[–] Clent@lemmy.world 22 points 9 months ago (2 children)

cApItaLIsm iS tHe OnlY EfFiCiEnT sYsUUuuuuM!!11!1!1 - every capitalist-simp

[–] surewhynotlem@lemmy.world 7 points 9 months ago (1 children)

Capitalism is very analogous to evolution. I wouldn't call it efficient in any way.

[–] Gold_E_Lox@lemmy.blahaj.zone 2 points 9 months ago (2 children)

interesting, pls expand

[–] surewhynotlem@lemmy.world 9 points 9 months ago (3 children)

Someone starts a new company. It either grows or dies. The company can change over time to adapt to it's environment, it can split, it can spawn new companies. The ones that fit best in their environment survive. The ones that don't die. Some companies fill a specific niche and never grow beyond that. If they grow too big they can outpace their environment and destroy it and themselves.

[–] orrk@lemmy.world 10 points 9 months ago

and some turn into literal cancer that is killing society!

[–] Perfide@reddthat.com 8 points 9 months ago

Some companies fill a specific niche and never grow beyond that. If they grow too big they can outpace their environment and destroy it and themselves.

Don't mind me, just fantasizing about the alternate timeline where Amazon never expanded past selling books.

[–] can@sh.itjust.works 2 points 9 months ago (1 children)

Is that efficiency?

[–] frokie@lemmy.world 4 points 9 months ago

Nope that’s why it takes so long and causes species extinction along the way

[–] LemmyKnowsBest@lemmy.world 1 points 9 months ago* (last edited 9 months ago)

pls expand:

C a p i t a l i s m i s a n a l o g o u s t o e v o l u t i o n . I w o u l d n ' t c a l l i t e f f i c i e n t i n a n y w a y .

pls expound:

[–] JasonDJ@lemmy.zip 5 points 9 months ago* (last edited 9 months ago)

Efficiency only comes at scale. Only way to be truly efficient in capitalism is to ultimately have the entire system fold into one conglomerate monopoly.

At that point, how is that better than communism or socialism?

[–] Jessvj93@lemmy.world 21 points 9 months ago

The ability to efficiently empty your wallet into a company's bank account.

[–] PugJesus@kbin.social 17 points 9 months ago* (last edited 9 months ago)

The efficiency of the system at making a few people very rich. Sure, it impoverishes people like us - but someday, WE might be rich! And then people like us better watch our step!

[–] PugJesus@kbin.social 65 points 9 months ago (1 children)

"It takes MONTHS to get surgery in those dirty socialist countries!"

Everyone I know who has taken months to get in for surgery in THIS fucking country:

[–] bdonvr@thelemmy.club 17 points 9 months ago* (last edited 9 months ago) (1 children)

And the poor people who don't go to the hospital unless they're actively dying because they're living paycheck to paycheck and cant afford it...

Shit, not even "poor" people, not with these healthcare premiums and prices....

[–] Fester@lemm.ee 8 points 9 months ago* (last edited 9 months ago)

Thats exactly what they mean when they complain about wait times in other countries. In their mind, it’s better for other people to suffer and die than to be in front of them in line. Especially poor people.

[–] gmtom@lemmy.world 42 points 9 months ago (1 children)

It's always some American that seems to personally know a ton of people that live in the UK and waited 2 years to have some major surgery. Or know someone that was stabbed and had to wait 36 hours in a A&E waiting room.

I mean don't get me wrong the NHS is stretched very thin under the tories and ambulances especially are pretty fucked st the minute, but when I broke my arm I was stabilised quickly overnight, scheduled for an op in the morning, operated on, given time to recover and 2 good meals and sent on my way withing 24 hours od admission. And then just the other day when I dislocated my knee and tore a ligament I was seen to, stabiled and released within a few hours.

[–] funkless_eck@sh.itjust.works 13 points 9 months ago

when I was in the uk I went in with an eye infection on Christmas eve as my GP was shut - 8 hour wait

when my appendix went septic - instantly into surgery

people just think they should always be triaged top of the list. yes, it sucks that it hurts, but it's probably not an emergency

[–] Vorticity@lemmy.world 38 points 9 months ago (1 children)

It's gotten to the point where my doctor's practice got bought by Walgreens and doesn't staff well enough to handle ANY acute cases. If I call for a sinus infection or because my little one is sick, I can't see my doctor or his pediatrician for upwards of two months. They send me to urgent care. They, admittedly, bill the same for urgent care as a normal visit, but there is no continuity of care, even for the pediatrician. Even when trying to schedule a 9 month checkup 45 days in advance, they tried to give me an appointment after his birthday!

What a fucking mess. Corporitization of Healthcare has utterly ruined the system. There is no room for real patient-doctor relationships anymore. Even though we like our doctors we can't see them!

[–] JasonDJ@lemmy.zip 2 points 9 months ago (1 children)

I actually use a telehealth primary and I really appreciate the convenience of it. They refer out whenever they need hands on stuff and there’s always something nearby.

That said, I do appreciate the niche for retail health for acute cases. A sick visit at my pediatrician is still $225 until I hit my deductible. I’d much rather pay MinuteClinic $30 and walk out with the same z-pack for my kid. It still sucks, but it beats deciding between “keep him home and hopefully he gets better before he’s a truant” or “paying $225”.

[–] Vorticity@lemmy.world 2 points 9 months ago (1 children)

Oof, I'm so glad that my insurance covers normal physician visits with just a copay, even before hitting my deductible.

Just curious, how bad is your deductible?

[–] JasonDJ@lemmy.zip 3 points 9 months ago* (last edited 9 months ago)

That was the HDHP so it was $1500/individual, $3000/family, per year.

The premiums were low though (well, lower. Total cost of my families healthcare was $27k last year but that was including my employers contribution to premiums). Last year my employer had a great program for seeding HSA (huge match) so it was slightly less expensive than the $500 deductible plan, even considering out-of-pocket max for both plans.

It sucks that there’s so much strategy involved in basic healthcare. It sucks that anyone has to make the decision between get their kid the healthcare they need, or not spend $225 for 3 minutes of their doctors time. It sucks even more that someone like me, whose family grosses nearly 200k, even has to think about that. That’s not a dig at “those dirty poors” or anything…more of a claim of the absurdity of the damn thing. Like…how the fuck do people on the median in become even manage? Or even below it? It’s just not possible.

[–] bl_r@lemmy.dbzer0.com 34 points 9 months ago

My roommate waited 9 months for a specialty surgery, but the surgeon injured themself right before his surgery and he then needed to go on the waitlist for an additional 6 months. He finally got the surgery, but instead of it being in the summer, it was during midterms, which fucked him over.

I fucking hate American healthcare, and I hate the “socialism is when you wait 6 months for a doctor” bullshit that always comes up when socialized healthcare is discussed.

[–] frickineh@lemmy.world 27 points 9 months ago

It took 5 months between my doctor putting me in the system to get my tubes tied and when I was able to get it scheduled. I need an ultrasound and my doctor was like "get that asap" which apparently means 2 months because that was the next opening. I'm supposed to have a skin cancer screening once a year since I've had it before and that took 3 months to schedule. Yeah, US healthcare is suuuuper efficient.

[–] RememberTheApollo_@lemmy.world 20 points 9 months ago* (last edited 9 months ago) (1 children)

No kidding. 6 month wait to see a PCP for a physical. 3 weeks to see them for an acute issue. Off to the ED to wait hours or walk-in and pay a premium. Maybe you lose your PCP because you changed jobs or your job changed insurance. But you can pay a premium out of pocket to go to your old one.

The republicans got the death panels they were screaming about. They just wanted to make sure they were profitable.

[–] Pipoca@lemmy.world 16 points 9 months ago

You see, government death panels are terrible.

Corporate death panels to boost profitability, though, are freedom, baseball, and apple pie.

[–] TellusChaosovich@lemmy.world 19 points 9 months ago

I called all the local PCPs today. One entire hospital system doesn't accept my insurance (Cigna) due to price negotiations. All the others don't have new patient appointments until December. So I guess in about 11 months, I can find out if I'm healthy!

[–] Assman@sh.itjust.works 16 points 9 months ago

Imagine sticking up for shitty insurance companies 🤮

[–] rivermonster@lemmy.world 2 points 9 months ago

Spot on, well played OP!

[–] wafflez@lemmy.world 2 points 9 months ago

But I thought we weren't allowed to compare the US to other countries

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