this post was submitted on 05 Nov 2023
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[–] schnurrito@discuss.tchncs.de 76 points 10 months ago (12 children)

You think you're going to get a better answer by asking that here rather than by reading the Wikipedia article or a media company's summary of what Hamas is?!

As neutrally as possible:

Hamas is an organization in the area of historical Palestine. It has been governing the Gaza Strip, a small piece of land between Israel, Egypt and the Mediterranean Sea, since 2007.

Ever since then, Israel has been blockading the Gaza Strip. Every few years, eg. in 2014 and 2021 and now again, Hamas fires rockets at Israel or otherwise attacks it, to which Israel responds with airstrikes.

Palestinian narrative: Israel is a settler colonial state that has taken away Palestinian land and is imprisoning Gazans in Gaza. Fighting against that is legitimate resistance against oppression. Israel's goal is ethnic cleansing of the Palestinians.

Israeli narrative: Israel is a safe haven for the historically oppressed Jewish people. Arabs have plenty of other countries for themselves. The aim of Hamas is to eliminate the Jewish state and maybe even the Jewish people. Israel is doing its best to avoid civilian casualties in its airstrikes against Gaza.

The actual truth: There is no such thing as the actual truth. There is a reason why this is the most difficult conflict in the world.

inb4 people with strong opinions on both sides tell me their opinion is obviously right and the above is nowhere near neutral

[–] Nobsi@feddit.de 30 points 10 months ago (1 children)

Adding onto this: the conflict has been going on since way earlier than hamas emergence.

[–] schnurrito@discuss.tchncs.de 15 points 10 months ago (11 children)

Of course. If you read older history, you'll notice that this used to be an Arab-Israeli conflict with Arab states on one side and Israel on the other. They fought wars against each other like in 1948, 1967 and whenever the Yom Kippur War was.

Nowadays Arab states and Israel aren't anywhere near as hostile to each other as they used to be, so the conflict now is mostly between Israel and Palestinian organizations (PLO, Hamas).

[–] NOT_RICK@lemmy.world 7 points 10 months ago (1 children)
[–] Redditgee@lemmy.world 8 points 10 months ago (2 children)

Tom Kippur war was 1973

Ah, yes. When the Arabs tried to dislodge the Israelis on Tom's birthday.

[–] NOT_RICK@lemmy.world 7 points 10 months ago

I’ve been had by autocorrect yet again

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[–] caesar_salad83@lemmy.world 10 points 10 months ago* (last edited 10 months ago) (3 children)

No matter what "narrative" you seek to believe, the fact is that Hamas hasn't been firing every once in awhile - They have been firing rockets and mortars regularly. Sometimes daily. You can see a list here and more info here

These attacks almost exclusively target civilians. more than 20,000 rockets in the past 20 years.

Additionally, airborne arson attacks are carried out..

edit:fixed links

[–] bionicjoey@lemmy.ca 11 points 10 months ago (1 children)

You fucked up your links by putting bangs in front of them. Don't put bangs in front of your links. That's for embedding images

[–] caesar_salad83@lemmy.world 4 points 10 months ago

Thanks, just started using boost and I used it's link function. either I don't know what I'm doing (probably), or it's a big.

[–] schnurrito@discuss.tchncs.de 8 points 10 months ago (2 children)

Point taken. The point was mainly that the escalations (to which Israel responds with airstrikes or invasions) happen every few years. Most of the time, people in other parts of the world don't really hear about what's going on there in the media. The times when we do are probably because such an escalation happens (e.g. now).

Your links don't work for me by the way, I can see in the source code what you meant to link to, but they don't display as links for me.

[–] caesar_salad83@lemmy.world 4 points 10 months ago

Thanks, fixed the links.

What most people don't realize is how much this situation is constant. these escalations are only peaks in an ongoing conflict.

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[–] jungle@lemmy.world 5 points 10 months ago

Bravo. This is the right answer.

[–] BilboBargains@lemmy.world 4 points 10 months ago

It's used to put nails in

[–] masquenox@lemmy.world 1 points 10 months ago (1 children)

TLDR

The Holocaust cannot possibly be true because "enlightened centrists" cannot handle truth and simply declares "there is no such thing as the actual truth."

[–] schnurrito@discuss.tchncs.de 1 points 10 months ago (1 children)

The funny thing about this comment is that it tells me nothing about whether you are sympathetic to Israel or to the Palestinians, they might both write exactly this and think they've completely destroyed me.

I looked into your comment history and see you're pro-Palestinian, but I would not have been able to guess this just from this comment.

[–] masquenox@lemmy.world 1 points 10 months ago

that it tells me nothing about whether you are sympathetic to Israel or to the Palestinians

Why should that matter to a centrist?

After all... the whole reason centrists love this whole "there is no truth" trope is because it's one of the bitterly few ways to justify clinging to whichever false narrative is least threatening to the status quo.

So why should you care?

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[–] steventhedev@lemmy.world 37 points 10 months ago (2 children)

Hamas is a terrorist organization currently engaged in a war with Israel. They are the defacto rulers of the Gaza strip, and most of their members are in Gaza. However, many Hamas leaders live outside of Gaza.

They are listed as a terrorist organization by the US, Canada, UK, the EU, and more.

Their charter declares their goals to be the violent destruction of Israel, the establishment of an Islamic caliphate in the land of Palestine, and killing all Jews worldwide.

[–] nix@merv.news 8 points 10 months ago* (last edited 10 months ago) (3 children)

Their charter doesnt state that. It was changed in 2017. Their current charter clearly states their conflict isn’t with Jewish people.

“Palestine is a land that was seized by a racist, anti-human and colonial Zionist project that was founded on a false promise (the Balfour Declaration),”

The Islamic Resistance Movement "Hamas" is a Palestinian Islamic national liberation and resistance movement. Its goal is to liberate Palestine and confront the Zionist project. Its frame of reference is Islam, which determines its principles, objectives and means. “

https://palwatch.org/storage/documents/hamas%20new%20policy%20document%20010517.pdf

Netanyahu helped Hamas get their funding so the moderate party in Palestine would get less support

https://www.theatlantic.com/ideas/archive/2023/10/israel-gaza-netanyahu/675597/

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[–] themurphy@lemmy.world 2 points 10 months ago

They are listed as a terrorist organization by the US, Canada, UK, the EU, and more.

Not hard to see how we are clearly taking sides in this conflict. Sickening.

Palestine and Israel are both awful to each other, and here we pretend to make Israel the good guys and Palestine the bad. As if that's even possible to say which is worse.

[–] jet@hackertalks.com 26 points 10 months ago* (last edited 10 months ago)

https://simple.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hamas

Hamas (Arabic: حماس, acronym of Harakat al-Muqawama al-Islamiyya, Arabic: حركة المقاومة الاسلامية, literally "Islamic Resistance Movement") is a Palestinian Sunni Islamist militant group. It was started in 1987 during the First Intifada by Ahmed Yassin and Abdel Aziz al-Rantissi as the Gaza branch of the Muslim Brotherhood organization in Egypt. In the 2006 Palestinian election, Hamas got 74 of 132 seats in parliament and controls the Gaza Strip. The group wants to build a Palestinian state based on Sharia law in the area that is now Israel, the West Bank, and Gaza Strip. Hamas does not recognize the State of Israel.[2] it has been designated a terrorist organization by many countries due to its attacks, including suicide bombings and rocket attacks.

[–] Zippit@lemmy.world 10 points 10 months ago (1 children)

Depending on the narrator, they're either freedom fighters or terrorists. The question should be why and how does Hamas exist? They didn't pop up one moment and started killing people.

If you're really interested, read some different sources or listen to some podcasts from both sides and you'll have a bigger sense of things.

[–] Isoprenoid@programming.dev 12 points 10 months ago (1 children)

or listen to some podcasts from both sides

And listen to podcasts from a third party. Try to find sources that are as objective as possible.

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[–] intensely_human@lemm.ee 6 points 10 months ago (1 children)

It’s an organization that controls the palestinian people. It’s a government, but there hasn’t been an election in seventeen years.

That’s about all I know

[–] Madison420@lemmy.world 2 points 10 months ago

Well sorta, technically they're only the adhoc government of occupied Gaza.

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