this post was submitted on 22 May 2024
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MeanwhileOnGrad
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This is -- unironically -- the only pro Trump viewpoint I have ever encountered that ever made sense to me.
I was arguing IRL with a group of central Asian people about US politics, and they said more or less, I just know Obama did all sorts of bombing and drone strikes and sanctions, and I know ever since it's been Trump he's been pulling the US military out of places and we've finally been able to get some good stuff done. I like Trump, Biden's gonna support Israel and all sorts of other enemies to us and so fuck him, we like Trump.
Honestly? I couldn't even say anything. Like yes, if you're aligned more or less against the United States, then Trump is probably a good thing. I definitely don't agree with it -- their definition of "good stuff" wasn't one I agreed with, and there are plenty of people who are very very bad people who also are not on the same side as the US. I don't think that it would be a good thing letting Russia crush Ukraine or China crush Taiwan or any other little minor massacre on the world stage that we're preventing instead of causing for once. But, if you're telling me that's your viewpoint and why you support Trump, I definitely won't say you are wrong.
I find it to be a naive viewpoint because if American influence contracts that power vacuum will be filled by authoritarian nations like China and Russia. If anyone thinks groups like Wagner are better for places like Africa than the US has been I think they’re lying to themselves. Not even saying the US hasn’t exploited and manipulated much of the world, it’s just that things can always get worse.
Yeah. It depends what country you're in, but I think a lot of what the US does on the world stage is just a function of what happens when you have a giant concentration of money and military power all in one place, and getting rid of the US will make things exponentially worse because even the flimsy little democratic guard rails on the US government are better than anything else that's currently on offer.
I think the solution is to work on strengthening the guard rails, instead of assuming that if we just reduce the power of the US government because it does terrible things (which, it does), the world will all of a sudden become a nice or fair place in its absence.
Trump is undoubtedly bad for the US, like a brexit that only lasts 4 years, (hopefully.) He destroys our international credibility and will leave an indelible scar on our international relationships.
However, this statement doesn't make sense:
Trump will give Israel a blank check, and he'll probably want to push the missile launch buttons himself if given the opportunity. He even recognized Jerusalem as the capital of Israel.
I do think that Trump would do a lot more damage to the Palestinians; that's true. This whole conversation took place before the current operation in Gaza. I think what the person I was talking to was talking about was a little more referring to effective diplomatic and strategic assistance to the Israelis, which Biden also does (and fuck him for it), which Trump is just inherently incapable of by virtue of being a dumbfuck on an almost unimaginable level.
In the long run, I think Trump and Netanyahu would be sort of neck and neck for who can do the most damage to Israel and make the average Israeli person less safe and interfere with Israel being able to accomplish their goals against any people who aren't completely powerless.
Just a note on Trump WRT Israel.
The orange idiot got a lot of help and direction from Netanyahu in the 2016 election, including, allegedly, intelligence on the democratic party and Hillary Clinton acquired by Mossad. If you think he's going to do anything but help Netanyahu with his genocide you are delusional.
E.g.
https://www.npr.org/2024/03/27/1240995103/trump-seeks-to-capitalize-on-bidens-frustration-with-israels-netanyahu
Its hard to do an apples to apples comparison, because like conflicts change. But Trump dropped more bombs per year than Obama did. The number under him also sharply increased for his first year and than decreased year by year after.