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Despite taking place in the future, Star Trek can't predict the future. And they have definitely used problematic people who were already dead (Sigmund Freud) or portrayed them in a pretty racist way anyway (Genghis Khan).
Edit: On top of that, you have actors in Star Trek who are thoroughly loathsome people like Whoopi Goldberg and Joe Piscopo.
Guiñan is an awesome character and I throughly wish they’d fired Whoopi from that role in Picard. I thought Ito Aghayere did a great job in the role.
All the Musk references in Discovery are so cringe. I just try to pretend that in that universe, Musk was a decent human.
in the kelvin universe someone time traveled back and replaced him with a talking pie for some reason and that's why everyone thought he was a saint
Disco doesn't take place in the Kelvin universe, and even if it did, Musk lived before the timelines diverged.
Well, you see, um, the reason it still works this way is because shut up.
Fair enough.
Let’s all just pretend it’s a movie. You can get away with a lot more if you do that.
Can his best friend be a killer robot driving instructor?
Kirk and crew traveled back in time to our own past on multiple occasions, ipso facto the Kelvin timeline split causes ripples both directions in time.
Kirk and crew traveled back to our past from the prime timeline, though. We have no evidence that the Kelvin timeline Kirk did the same thing.
Subtle reminder that our own culture still repeats the lie that Edison "invented the lightbulb" and teaches children about how Eli Whitney inventing the cotton gin revolutionized the American textile industry without mentioning how it also created a massive boom in demand for enslaved labor. And we all tend to ignore the fact that Einstein was a serial adulterer and a monster to his first wife, or that James Watson was a racist ass. Steve Jobs was by all accounts a terrible person and died because of his belief in quackery, but his contribution to tech history will outlast those footnotes. Henry Ford was one of the worst humans on the planet, but he changed the course of the manufacturing industry forever, and he gets credit for that in spite of him being a huge piece of shit.
The overall effects of Elon Musk's contributions to the culture have yet to be fully litigated, but his influence on the direction of private space travel is undeniable, and is probably the one thing about him that will outlive him, especially with regard to a space-oriented future society like the Federation. To them, his idiotic and toxic antics on Twitter/X/whatever-dumb-shit-he-renames-it-to-next are probably a long-forgotten historical footnote.
Sure, we expect the enlightened future of Star Trek to be better with its historical revisionism, but the personalities of famous innovators or self-proclaimed luminaries often fade into obscurity while the lasting consequences of their influence remains. People on Star Trek are meant to be an idealized version of what we strive for, but they are far from perfect, and the veil of history often obscures the ugly truth of how society-shifting change often comes about.
First Contact touches on this very topic by portraying the legendary Zephram Cochrane as a philandering drunk who lets his colleague Lily Sloane do much of the hard work while he gets all the credit.
History is messy and posterity doesn't always get it right.
The point is about making better decisions in the future, not an expectation that existing problematic choices will be magially undone.
And I'm saying that is not something done even when picking dead people. Read what Freud did to Emma Eckstein sometime. I doubt whoever wrote Phantasms was aware of it.
Having to research the entire biography of a historical figure before putting them in a TV show is a bit much. And if you're only going to accept angelic historical figures with no known wrongdoing, the pickings will be slim. Mister Rogers can only be depicted in so many shows before we run out of ideas...
That was kind of my point, but also I would say that A) Emma Eckstein isn't some secret, it's just not talked about much and B) that's a hell of a lot worse than what the real Paul Stamets is involved with. The only real difference is that Paul Stamets hasn't been dead long enough for a writer in the 1990s to not realize what a colossal piece of shit he actually was.
That's the whole point, isn't it? We shouldn't cherry-pick living figures as something that future people should universally loathe, because there are many, many examples of historical figures whose loathsomeness they (and we) also gloss over.
Wikipedia
Talk about poor choice of words.
I'm out of the loop. What's the problem with Whoopy?
https://www.thelist.com/1525436/whoopi-goldberg-most-controversial-moments/
TL;Dr she's old and rich so problems that don't happen to her don't matter
Those issues are all fairly mild IMO
Defending Bill Cosby is mild to you?
She didn't defend him, and actually did a 180 once proof came out.
Precisely. Thats character growth ffs
No, see, you're not allowed to do takesies backsies. Once you screw up (or people think you did) you're canceled forever.
/s needed because some people actually think this way
When a black person does it? Yes. It's understandable. Just like with OJ.
Lemmy gets mad about the "two tiered" justice system but black folks are more than familiar with the reality that even wealth and celebrity won't protect them, much less innocence, and white America is more than happy to assume guilt on the part of black celebrities while there's no shortage of eager defenders of your Weinstein types.
That doesn't make it good, or right, but centuries of mistreatment by the justice system doesn't tend to produce a lot of trust in that system. It just produces cynicism, deserved or otherwise.
I've never heard anyone defend Weinstein...
I've seen people do it on Lemmy lol
"Convicted in the press blah blah blah"
Uh, my dude, literally the entire industry knew about him for decades before anybody managed to take him down, and they all did nothing. In their inaction they further hurt his victims, and allowed him to victimize others while they looked the other way. That's just as bad if not worse.
I'm aware that Whoopie once said that the holocaust "wasn't about race, but man inhumanity towards man." For which she apologized. Is there something else that makes you say she's thoroughly loathsome?
She said it, apologized, then said it again and apologized again.