Neoliberal ideology leads to fascism. The actual neoliberals themselves are not fascists. We can work with neoliberals. The problem with scratch a liberal and a fascist bleeds is that it's a mindset that creates enemies out of people who are our allies.

Don't get me wrong. Neoliberals need to abandon their ideology in favor of socialism. And a populist narrative wouldn't hurt the Democrats either. But if we blind ourselves to the difference between neoliberals and fascists, we are making things harder for ourselves.

I think we actually agree on this, we just phrase it slightly differently.

[–] TotallynotJessica@lemmy.world 8 points 2 weeks ago (1 children)

I'm a firm believer in providing answers to why we're here. The buck stops with power, and the rich had all the power. Neolibs did their bidding, and thus they deserve no kindness. I'm never listening to their arguments for business again. They need to be told to shut the fuck up. They have no goodwill from the public, so we don't need to pretend to like them.

They can be our allies because our interests might align, but we gain more by explaining why they failed than by letting them have respect. We need to build the left as an answer, and neolibs have no place with us.

[–] ToastedPlanet@lemmy.blahaj.zone 0 points 2 weeks ago (3 children)

Rather than scratch a liberal and a fascist bleeds a more useful statement would be today's neoliberals can be tomorrow's socialists. But to do that we have to do the work of convincing people to be socialists. Teaching people neoliberalism is a scam is the first step in that.

[–] zante 2 points 2 weeks ago (1 children)

It’s a mistake to think liberal centrism is closer to the left than right. It’s not linear . More triangular.

It’s has been shown and writ large that the proletariat will move from left to right and vice versa, without going near liberal centrism

[–] ToastedPlanet@lemmy.blahaj.zone 2 points 2 weeks ago

In the context of a 2-d, Euclidean geometry, x and y axis political compass putting neoliberals slightly right of center makes sense. In different models a different position could make sense. People don't need to move through neoliberalism. The issue is that many if not most people in our society have neoliberal ideas in their heads.

Regan, Bush Sr, Clinton, W, Obama were all some variation on neoliberal. Neoliberal rhetoric laid the ground work for Trump. Biden also being a neoliberal hasn't moved the needle on this while in office. We can't wait for someone to do it for us. We have to help people fully internalize neoliberalism as a scam. Then teach them about socialism.

[–] EndlessApollo@lemmy.world 2 points 2 weeks ago* (last edited 2 weeks ago)

Nah we need to start punching neoliberals until they stop organizing and start supporting actual left causes, because they will never, under any circumstances, allow anything close to socialism. It works with nazis, why not their best friends? Either way it'll be very fun :3

[–] spujb@lemmy.cafe 0 points 2 weeks ago

i like this :)

[–] EndlessApollo@lemmy.world 2 points 2 weeks ago* (last edited 2 weeks ago)

Neoliberals rely on fascists to exist, there is no collaborating with them. Democrats will literally always side with the far right over the even remotely left, and will always collaborate with Republicans and recognize them as a legitimate party rather than a legitimate cancer that needs to be stopped. Neolibs (libs in general really) are the left wing of fascism, and can absolutely never be relied upon to fight fascism, because they will always work with fascists against the left until fascists kill them all