Gotta try and justify why destroying 34/35 hospitals, and just yesterday telling people in the last hospital to leave because they’re going to attack it as well.
Or having snipers setup to kill 21 people leaving that last one.
But sure tunnels!
this post was submitted on 13 Feb 2024
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I hope that one day Palestine will be free and we won’t need to read apologia for colonizers bombing a hospital.
The condoning of blowing up hospitals for hosting Hames is a very short step away from condoning the attack on the twin towers. Both are heinous and ugly offences irrespective of the "tactical" arguments.
Except hospitals are way further along that line. If you have issue with the system of US capitalist and military hegemony, the twin towers and pentagon are pretty direct targets. Not that that makes them a perfect target, there were obviously lots of collateral deaths, but it’s much less removed than hospitals are from Hamas.
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Regarding Al-Shifa hospital, there is video of Hamas taking some hostages inside, and widespread reporting of Hamas previously using part of the facility for interrogation/torture of civilians. That, in conjunction with the tunnel evidence, makes it a reasonable target for Israel to take control of (i.e. not a war crime). Personally I doubt the tunnel constitutes a command center. A method for discreetly bringing in captives makes more sense.
Are you referring to video from early in the war, where Hamas brought in two hostages who it turned out were wounded and Hamas was trying to get them treated? Because Israel was using that video as "proof" that Hamas was using that hospital as a "base", which is just fucked up in so many ways.
A couple of points here.
- The second Hamas brings a hostage in, it's a valid target for Israel to move into as well.
- You're taking Hamas's word on why they brought the hostages in.
- US intelligence disagrees with you. This was literally the first result of a cursory search.
- It doesn't matter at all in this analysis, but Hamas are the people that wounded these hostages in the first place. They don't have any moral high ground here.
- The second Hamas brings a hostage in, it's a valid target for Israel to move into as well.
Why?
- You're taking Hamas's word on why they brought the hostages in.
And you're taking Bibi's word that the only people the IDF has killed are Hamas ... even tho almost 50% of the pre-war Palestinian population was kids.
- US intelligence disagrees with you. This was literally the first result of a cursory search.
Where is the evidence?
- It doesn't matter at all in this analysis, but Hamas are the people that wounded these hostages in the first place. They don't have any moral high ground here.
And the IDF has killed over 30,000 Palestinians, mostly women and children.
I didn't say anything about civilian death rates mate. Pretty weird to accuse me of something that I've never said and is on-its-face absurd.
Regarding point 1, Israel obviously has the right to try to recover its citizens, taken hostage by a foreign military force, wherever they have evidence of them being. A hostage site is clearly a valid military target under IHL.
No response to # 3 or 4?
edit to add ... For # 1 you seem to be assuming that Drs would be aware somehow that Hamas had hostages, and that Drs somehow decided to contact the IDF to let them know ... which is a ton of assumptions.
4 is covered under "shit I never said or contested"
For 3 you're just going to have to accept that you can't always personally view US intelligence information.
A hostage site is clearly a valid military target under IHL.
Not a hospital where there's no harmful act being committed.
Earlier taken hostage or not, by no definition is transporting someone to a hospital to receive treatment a harmful act. People not desperately trying to justify war crimes would tend to consider it the exact OPPOSITE of a harmful act.
This is simply not true when IHL is looked at as a whole.
Hospitals do receive special protections. As a rule a hospital can never be attacked unless it becomes co-opted for military purposes or represents a legitimate military objective. At that point, the hospital must be notified prior to attack if doing so is at all reasonable. Further, all proportionality calculations must still be made regarding collateral damage.
The hospital became a legitimate target when Hamas militants, under military orders, brought in hostages.
Notifying the hospital was clearly unreasonable, as that would allow Hamas to remove the hostages, the recovery of which was the primary military objective.
Proportionality considerations dictated what was a reasonable attack. Israel didn't bomb the building into dust - they staged a controlled siege (to prevent the hostages from being moved) followed by a methodical taking of the facility.
Nothing about this was unreasonable or illegal given the full context.
unless it becomes co-opted for military purposes or represents a legitimate military objective
That's the IDF excuse, not the actual law.
all proportionality calculations must still be made regarding collateral damage.
You mean the ones the IDF clearly never bother with? Just yesterday, they killed 95 people, most of them civilians, to free 2 hostages.
The hospital became a legitimate target when Hamas militants, under military orders, brought in hostages.
First of all, that's flat out false. Second, it hasn't even been proven that it was the case. All we have is the word of the notoriously deceptive IDF.
Notifying the hospital was clearly unreasonable
Wrong again, genocide denier.
as that would allow Hamas to remove the hostages
Hostages who, if they were even there, were there for treatment?
the recovery of which was the primary military objective.
If you still believe that one, I have a pristine palace in Gaza to sell you..
Proportionality considerations dictated what was a reasonable attack
No. How many times are you going to be just confidently objectively wrong in one reply? Are you going for the record or something?
they staged a controlled siege (to prevent the hostages from being moved) followed by a methodical taking of the facility.
Did you get that bullshit verbatim from the IDF press release?
Nothing about this was unreasonable or illegal given the full context.
Literally everything about it was. You should be ashamed of yourself.