this post was submitted on 15 Jan 2024

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230

Tories facing 1997-style general election wipeout (www.telegraph.co.uk)

submitted 10 months ago by Rapidcreek@lemmy.world to c/world@lemmy.world

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[–] Ep1cFac3pa1m@lemmy.world 59 points 10 months ago (3 children)

I’m not from the UK so my point of view means nothing, but I hope a Labour government will still support Ukraine. From my limited understanding it seems the Tories have been a domestic nightmare, but opposing Russian aggression is a policy I support.

[–] ABCDE@lemmy.world 37 points 10 months ago (1 children)

I don't see that changing.

[–] Ep1cFac3pa1m@lemmy.world 25 points 10 months ago (1 children)

I hope you’re right. Republicans in Congress have already fucked up America’s support. I don’t want Ukraine to lose any more support.

[–] ABCDE@lemmy.world 18 points 10 months ago

Luckily they are the equivalent of the Tories, who have supported Ukraine pretty well; Labour should at least be maintaining that if not improving upon it.

[–] TheGrandNagus@lemmy.world 35 points 10 months ago

Thankfully Ukraine is something pretty much everyone in parliament is unanimous on, there are very few exceptions.

[–] MonsterMonster@lemmy.world 19 points 10 months ago* (last edited 10 months ago)

If the Republicans get their way Ukraine can say goodbye to US support. Europe, including the UK, should step up to the plate and triple down in its support for Ukraine in funding and supplies and be prepared for military action with or without the US.

[–] MonsterMonster@lemmy.world 49 points 10 months ago (3 children)

Let's hope so. I look forward to a few Portillo moments. The Tories have caused so much damage to the UK in two words Brexit and Corruption.

[–] TheGrandNagus@lemmy.world 27 points 10 months ago (1 children)

Don't forget austerity. It's been a significantly larger impact to the UK than even Brexit has. Shit, if they didn't do austerity then Brexit would almost certainly never have happened.

[–] lolcatnip@reddthat.com 25 points 10 months ago

"Austerity" is such a bloodless word for class warfare.

[–] Squizzy@lemmy.world 6 points 10 months ago

Just in time for the next people to get all the blame with the wars happen

[–] MaxVoltage@lemmy.world -1 points 10 months ago

Labour?

[–] Wodge@lemmy.world 49 points 10 months ago (1 children)

Still too many Tory seats in Wales.

[–] TheGrandNagus@lemmy.world 16 points 10 months ago

Could've ended that sentence two words earlier.

[–] Wenchette@lemmy.ml 39 points 10 months ago

They deserve it

[–] ChicoSuave@lemmy.world 30 points 10 months ago (1 children)

Good

[–] hitmyspot@aussie.zone 12 points 10 months ago (1 children)

Yes, I was quite surprised they didn't get the boot last election.

[–] Gradually_Adjusting@lemmy.world 13 points 10 months ago (1 children)

You mean when we nixed Boris? That wasn't a "general election" as such.

[–] hitmyspot@aussie.zone 2 points 10 months ago

No, I meant in 2019. Brexit was already a mess. Instead they gained.

Saying that, I didn't think brexit would get up either.

[–] phoneymouse@lemmy.world 11 points 10 months ago

All it took was driving the country off a cliff with Brexit. UK has the same problem with Tories that the US has with Republicans and a population of total morons lining up to vote for them.

[–] FrankTheHealer@lemmy.world 3 points 10 months ago

Good

[–] CritFail@lemmy.world -3 points 10 months ago (3 children)

Anyone else think Biden and Sunak are incentivised to take US and UK put boots on the ground over Israel-Hamas-Houthi conflicts? Tories face wipe-out, and Biden faces a close call with Trump, and nothing helps guarantee re-election like being at war.

[–] Rapidcreek@lemmy.world 7 points 10 months ago (1 children)

You mean it's all political and that Houthi missle that just hit a container ship means nothing?

[–] CritFail@lemmy.world 0 points 10 months ago* (last edited 10 months ago) (2 children)

But it is all political. Houthis are funded by SA and Iran. They are attacking because of Israel's genocidal treatment of 2 million people in Gaza. I mean the Houthis are awful, as are Hamas, but there are lots of other awful groups doing awful stuff around the globe 24/7 that impact UK and US interests but don't prompt severe military retaliation. Russia tried to shoot down a RAF jet last year - nothing happened, diplomacy won out. So why the sudden need to approve these strikes on a weekend? Attacks have been happening for months. Why didn't they do an emergency recall to put the decision before Congress and HoC? They are playing with fire and they know it.

I'm just saying that a war declaration against a much less well-armed militia in Yemen for a prolonged military campaign and something they can claim to be in aid of a 'good' cause could be convenient to both Biden and Sunak for a boost in the polls. It also comes with fewer risks as they arent a nuclear power like Russia, Iran, SA, or Israel (yay proxy war). Sadly, I wouldn't put it past either leader to have considered this.

[–] missing_forklift@sh.itjust.works 3 points 10 months ago

Houthis are funded by SA and Iran.

houthis are at war with saudi arabia for better part of last decade, and more broadly for almost three decades. it's a part of proxy iran-saudi conflict

They are attacking because of Israel’s genocidal treatment of 2 million people in Gaza

they are attacking because iran told them so. houthis, like hezbollah, are iranian proxies

Russia tried to shoot down a RAF jet last year

and turks shot down a russian jet couple of years ago, and ultimately also nothing happened

Why didn’t they do an emergency recall to put the decision before Congress and HoC? They are playing with fire and they know it.

bs. airstrikes are easy and low-risk, the real, permanent solution to this problem would be boots on the ground and/or high intensity airstrikes on iranian weapons manufacturers. neither are gonna happen, but airstrikes provide that "something is being done" vibe

since when saudis or iranians have nukes?

[–] Rapidcreek@lemmy.world 3 points 10 months ago

but there are lots of other awful groups doing awful stuff around the globe 24/7 that impact UK and US interests but don't prompt severe military retaliation

Name one that is blocking a major transport lane by firing missles at ships. We took action when a US Navy ship was attacked by 24 Houthi drones. You don't attack US ships in international waters and not expect blowback. To parapharse Godfather, it's not political, it's business.

[–] prole@sh.itjust.works 3 points 10 months ago (1 children)

Based on what I've read today, it seems as though the Biden administration is running out of patience with Netanyahu. I'd be surprised if anything real came of that, but at the very least, I highly doubt he has any interest whatsoever putting US troops in Gaza.

[–] CritFail@lemmy.world 1 points 10 months ago

I really hope so. I doubt troops would be deployed to Gaza too, but would not put it past them to consider deploying to Yemen to take out the Houthis.

[–] SkepticalButOpenMinded@lemmy.ca 2 points 10 months ago (1 children)

That theory doesn’t make much sense to me. The military conflicts have been political losers for Biden. Polling consistently shows that Americans believe (for some insane reason) that the Ukraine and Gaza conflicts wouldn’t have happened under Trump. Gaza in particular has split Biden’s base. The best thing that could happen for Biden is if all the conflicts end before the election.

[–] CritFail@lemmy.world 1 points 8 months ago* (last edited 8 months ago)

It seems there are some in the UK Government willing to game the Israel Gaza conflict to their electoral advantage. Not boots on ground, and thankfully its being called out by the opposition as wrong, but shows they are at least considering this in their deliberations for calling for a ceasefire. https://feddit.uk/post/9265224

[+] Wanderer@lemm.ee -31 points 10 months ago* (last edited 10 months ago) (3 children)

I hope Farage leads reform, that will reduce the Tories even more.

We actually do need big reforms in this country. I hate Farage for brexit, but credit where credits do he did something I thought was impossible. Hopefully he can help push through some much needed reforms in the UK which the party stands for but they will never see power.

I cannot put into words how much I hate first past the post, its the worst voting system. Also why are there are so many people that have land money and power because of William the first gave there ancestors land, Lords needs to end. Immigration is way too high, bringing in as many people per year as a large city and targeting house building less than half that is a crisis. This country is doing pretty badly but a few big decisions and it could be a lot better. As bad as reform are, they are right in some ways and the less power the tories have the better.

Edit: Guess people like the Tories or they don't understand FPTP voting.

[–] MonsterMonster@lemmy.world 17 points 10 months ago (1 children)

Let me understand this. You hate Farage yet you have hope in him. The electoral, honours and Lords systems certainly need reform. The Tories are corrupt and self-serving whose only interest are the party and business. Brexit and Teeside.

[+] Wanderer@lemm.ee -20 points 10 months ago (1 children)

Yes the man gets things done see brexit. You don't have to like someone to see that are able to achieve things.

So if you hate the tories why wouldn't you want reform to get more votes? As per the article they won't get any seats but if farage runs then the tories will lose even more seats.

Seems like a reason to want farage to run. Yet that's an unpopular view?

[–] Weslee@lemmy.world 25 points 10 months ago* (last edited 10 months ago) (1 children)

Brexit was done with lies and misinformation and you praise it like it was the masterclass of politics, I suppose it's not entirely untrue, but it isn't a happy thing for most

[–] Wanderer@lemm.ee -4 points 10 months ago* (last edited 10 months ago) (1 children)

I didn't say it was a happy thing. I said I didn't like him for it.

Doesn't mean he isn't good at achieving things which he is. Jesus are people so one sided they just blind to anything positive unless their side did it.

Brexit was an absolute shower of shit, I never said otherwise. That in no way makes anything else I said untrue.

[–] OctopusKurwa@lemm.ee 6 points 10 months ago

"Achieving things" = riling up racists

[–] Person264@lemmings.world 8 points 10 months ago (1 children)

I think people don't like your suggestion/implication of Farage being the one pushing through reforms more than liking Tories.

[–] Wanderer@lemm.ee -1 points 10 months ago (3 children)

Who else is then? Labour aren't.

The more votes Farage gets the less the Tories get. Right win people aren't going to vote for the green party so it's good that there is a right wing party 1 splitting the vote and 2 pushing for actual good things so yea as unpopular as it is I hope the tories lose seats and more people on the right want changes to be made.

[–] TheGrandNagus@lemmy.world 6 points 10 months ago

Don't you remember the last GE? Farage's party stepped down in many Tory seats, and stayed in many strong labour seats.

They were splitting Labour's vote, not the Conservative vote.

[–] Person264@lemmings.world 5 points 10 months ago

You're right, but I think the idea of Farage being in charge of pushing through any sorts of ideas (even if it's reforms that are good) is making people uncomfortable, which is what could be read from your first comment.

[–] ABCDE@lemmy.world 2 points 10 months ago

That is not what happened during the last election and you know it.

[–] ABCDE@lemmy.world 7 points 10 months ago (2 children)

Edit: Guess people like the Tories or they don’t understand FPTP voting.

Nope, just your comments about immigration.

[–] Damdy@lemmy.world 5 points 10 months ago

It's so rarely the people in the cities who actually live and work with immigrants every day who don't want them. It's the small village people who suddenly have 1 brown person they don't know how to interact with.

[–] Wanderer@lemm.ee -4 points 10 months ago

We have net migration of 750,000. Do people even think about how much that is? If we need that many immigrants we are a failed country. Our education system needs to be vastly improved.

But that's not the point of this amount of immigration largely. We are only aiming to build 300,000 houses a year and yet we have a housing crisis and are taking in net, as many people as a large city each year. The reason is to keep wages low and house prices high.

Why people want that I don't know.