I’m not going to absolve the West which has contributed far more to this problem historically (though if China does not turn things around, this may not be the case for much longer). But China is an equal partner in the ongoing destruction of our biosphere, and painting them as some environmental champion is extremely misleading. Along with the US they are one of the biggest obstacles to decarbonization.

[–] queermunist@lemmy.ml 2 points 1 year ago

Calling them a partner is accurate - their emissions are in partnership with our consumption. I think it's important to remember what those emissions are for, though.

[–] yogthos@lemmy.ml -3 points 1 year ago (2 children)

Carbon emissions in China are far lower per capita than pretty much anywhere in the west, and that's including the fact that much of the stuff people in the west consume is manufactured in China.

[–] LibertyLizard 5 points 1 year ago* (last edited 1 year ago) (1 children)

So why not post per capita offshore wind production? How does that compare?

Anyway that’s not even true. China is near the middle of the pack for developed countries, and emits far more per capita than most nations. And getting worse every year as they build more coal plants than the rest of the world combined. https://worldpopulationreview.com/country-rankings/carbon-footprint-by-country#

I only posted this because you constantly post distorted positive reports of China’s environmental record while ignoring the negatives, which gives a misleading picture. China is far from the worst country environmentally but it’s also far from the best.

[–] yogthos@lemmy.ml -5 points 1 year ago

China is so far ahead of the rest of the world when it comes to renewables and nuclear that it's not even funny. China also has a concrete plan to become carbon neutral that it's implementing at scale while the west keeps doing greenwashing and paying lip service to transitioning off fossils. The coal use you mention has been found to be in line with China's 1.5c commitment.

Here's the stunning progress China has made just this year alone in implementing solar.

In addition to renewables, CHina is making a massive investment in nuclear and it's building 150 nuclear power plants.

In fact, fossil fuels less than half of power capacity.

China has more than 400,000 electric buses, about 99% of the world's total.

Furthermore, China has done massive reforestation that has no equivalent anywhere else that I'm aware of

It's kind of ironic that you posted a comment that's distorting the progress China has made in moving off fossils is doing while accusing me of doing the same. You're claiming that China is far from the best, and that's just demonstrably a false statement. No other country is doing anything on the scale of China right now. Here's a CSIS report showing that China is in fact the leader in global renewable energy. Meanwhile, studies show that it's US/EU who are overwhelmingly responsible for emissions.

I really have no idea why you felt the need to write a post full of distortions and misinformation.

[–] steltek@lemm.ee 1 points 1 year ago (1 children)

Wind power per capita would put China far lower than the west.

[+] yogthos@lemmy.ml -9 points 1 year ago (1 children)

Why would you lie about something that can be easily googled? https://www.reuters.com/markets/commodities/china-widens-renewable-energy-supply-lead-with-wind-power-push-2023-03-01/

[–] LibertyLizard 3 points 1 year ago (1 children)

Blatantly false. China produces far more energy than the rest of the world so of course it produces more wind energy—but again, not per capita: https://ourworldindata.org/grapher/wind-electricity-per-capita?tab=table

Note that Denmark, for example, produces 6 times the wind power per capita as does China. It’s not particularly close.

[+] yogthos@lemmy.ml -10 points 1 year ago (2 children)

Denmark is a tiny part of the west population wise. Compare all of western countries combined and the picture is very different. Again, why would you engage in such blatant cherry picking to misrepresent things?

[–] LibertyLizard 5 points 1 year ago (1 children)

I just picked the top one to show how far they are from being in the lead, which is what you claimed. If you actually look at the link I posted, you will see that almost every Western nation is ahead of China, even laggards like the US.

[+] yogthos@lemmy.ml -10 points 1 year ago (1 children)

That would be like me picking a tiny village in China to make a point. What I claimed is that China is far ahead of the west, and you jumped in with a straw man. I've already provided you lots of sources showing that China is ahead of the west by every conceivable measure when it comes to renewables, feel free to go read them.

[–] LibertyLizard 1 points 1 year ago (1 children)

I did read them but none of your links show that at all. I have to wonder if you read them. Some of them are quite informative as to just how bad their current policies are. I will work on a longer rebuttal to your long post later but I need to get back to work.

[–] steltek@lemm.ee 4 points 1 year ago (1 children)

If you compare the sum of all Western countries together then China loses on both total and per capital so I don't see what your point is. Per your own numbers above, even.