this post was submitted on 18 May 2024
1358 points (98.9% liked)
Science Memes
11086 readers
2593 users here now
Welcome to c/science_memes @ Mander.xyz!
A place for majestic STEMLORD peacocking, as well as memes about the realities of working in a lab.
Rules
- Don't throw mud. Behave like an intellectual and remember the human.
- Keep it rooted (on topic).
- No spam.
- Infographics welcome, get schooled.
This is a science community. We use the Dawkins definition of meme.
Research Committee
Other Mander Communities
Science and Research
Biology and Life Sciences
- !abiogenesis@mander.xyz
- !animal-behavior@mander.xyz
- !anthropology@mander.xyz
- !arachnology@mander.xyz
- !balconygardening@slrpnk.net
- !biodiversity@mander.xyz
- !biology@mander.xyz
- !biophysics@mander.xyz
- !botany@mander.xyz
- !ecology@mander.xyz
- !entomology@mander.xyz
- !fermentation@mander.xyz
- !herpetology@mander.xyz
- !houseplants@mander.xyz
- !medicine@mander.xyz
- !microscopy@mander.xyz
- !mycology@mander.xyz
- !nudibranchs@mander.xyz
- !nutrition@mander.xyz
- !palaeoecology@mander.xyz
- !palaeontology@mander.xyz
- !photosynthesis@mander.xyz
- !plantid@mander.xyz
- !plants@mander.xyz
- !reptiles and amphibians@mander.xyz
Physical Sciences
- !astronomy@mander.xyz
- !chemistry@mander.xyz
- !earthscience@mander.xyz
- !geography@mander.xyz
- !geospatial@mander.xyz
- !nuclear@mander.xyz
- !physics@mander.xyz
- !quantum-computing@mander.xyz
- !spectroscopy@mander.xyz
Humanities and Social Sciences
Practical and Applied Sciences
- !exercise-and sports-science@mander.xyz
- !gardening@mander.xyz
- !self sufficiency@mander.xyz
- !soilscience@slrpnk.net
- !terrariums@mander.xyz
- !timelapse@mander.xyz
Memes
Miscellaneous
founded 2 years ago
MODERATORS
you are viewing a single comment's thread
view the rest of the comments
view the rest of the comments
Amy is a chicken. Amy lays an egg. Brenda is a chicken. Brenda hatched from the egg Amy laid. The egg in question is clearly a chicken's egg, but is it Amy's egg, or Brenda's egg?
It was Amy's egg that Brenda inherited, so now it's Brenda's egg. So the OG egg was Amy's.
So, it doesn't become a Chicken's egg until Brenda has come into existence. Brenda being the chicken. The chicken has to exist for the egg to become a Chicken's egg.
The first chicken egg is the egg that Brenda hatched from, but it didn't become a chicken egg until Brenda was a chicken and not just a (proto-chicken) egg.
Right and wrong. It was a chicken's egg when Amy laid it, but it was a chicken egg when Brenda was hatched. So yes, the chicken has to exist for the first chicken's egg, but the first chicken hatched from a chicken egg, that was not a chicken's egg.
To clarify, I'm assuming that in this case Amy was the first evolution of the chicken, therefore she laid the first chicken's egg that was the second chicken egg, bevause her parents weren't chickens, so what was laid wasn't a chicken's egg until Amy hatched. Schrodinger's egg if you will.
Amy is a proto-chicken. Her offspring, Brenda, is the first creature containing the mutation that distinguishes chickens from proto-chickens. Brenda is the first chicken.
Amy's egg couldn't be a chicken egg because there was no such thing as a chicken when she laid it. There would be no such thing as a chicken until Brenda existed, at which time the egg that would become Brenda also became a chicken egg.
The chicken egg could not have come first. The first chicken egg was laid by something that was not quite a chicken, but it didn't become a chicken egg until it had developed into a chicken.
You established right away in your first post that Amy is a chicken. That means she came from a chicken egg, but it wasn't a chicken's egg until Amy was a chicken. Until the hatch it was her parent's egg, whatever species they may have been.
I think we're saying the same thing, but in my version, Amy was the first chicken hatched from non chicken parents, and laid the first chicken's egg, birthing Brenda.
In the end, chicken came first, which in turn made the egg, a chicken egg, and coincidentally that chicken's egg.
My bad, I was making a different point with that analogy, and I had moved on some time ago. The app I'm using makes it difficult to read back up the thread.
I think we are making similar arguments. I would say that the egg Amy hatched from is the first "chicken's egg", but it is only the first chicken's egg because it belongs to Amy, and it did not exist until chicken-Amy existed, which was some time well after the egg was laid.
Sorry, I'm getting distracted with real life right now.
What could possibly be more important than this?