First of all I'd like to apologize in advance for any insensitive statements I might make (I hope I don't though), I'm trying my best not to and I was just curious :)

I'm an 18-year-old cishet guy currently in uni and recently the thought popped into my head that I have no clue how the LGBTQ community would view me as someone who's not in the space or actively an ally. I would more accurately describe myself currently as a "don't care" person in the sense that to me it genuinely does not matter what someone identifies as or who someone is attracted to. I don't know how much this means, but I have multiple gay friends, my roommate is bi and I dated a person who went as a girl in day to day life because it was more convenient to her/them although she/they told me she/they partially identified as nonbinary (correct pronoun usage pls >.<) but I don't know if all this is the classic "but i have a black friend" argument that racists use.

To cut to the point: I'm curious as to how I would be seen by queer people in general, as I've witnessed both very inclusive and nice people (mostly here), but also some that said that LGBTQ places are not to be used by cishet people and I'm wondering what the best attitude to take would be.

Thanks!

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[–] leigh@lemmy.blahaj.zone 23 points 1 year ago (2 children)

Other people here are already doing a great job of covering the “what we think” and “whether welcome in queer spaces or not” aspects of your question, so let me dive into this part instead:

…someone who’s not in the space or actively an ally. I would more accurately describe myself currently as a “don’t care” person in the sense that to me it genuinely does not matter what someone identifies as or who someone is attracted to.

Ever watch the TV show Ted Lasso? There was a scene in the final season where one of the players on the football (soccer) team came out as gay. The other players tell him they “don’t care”, meaning to be supportive but not actually succeeding. Ted gives a speech and, as his character admits afterward, makes a poor comparison — but still does a good job of communicating to the others that they should care. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AcaUZ9R0y2c

So, like… I’m glad you’re not antagonizing any of us, but that’s just kind of the bare minimum for being decent, you know? And that is somewhat similar to racial discrimination: as a white person in North America, telling Black people I “don’t care that they’re Black” would tell them I haven’t considered that being Black is something core to their identity and how they experience the world because of the way society works. It would tell them I still see whiteness as the “default” but it’s “okay” to be something else. It would tell them that I might say something if I witnessed blatant racism happening, but they shouldn’t count on me to do so because I haven’t made any effort to learn how racism actually works and I might back down if I feel speaking up would put myself at any risk. But I do care, so I try to educate myself, and I look for opportunities to practice anti-racism. I absolutely make mistakes, but they tend to be easily forgiven so long as I show a willingness to listen, learn, and try.

But hey… I freely admit that I was way older than 18 when I finally started listening to people and began understanding all of this! So I absolutely don’t mean to “rake you over the coals” or anything. I just tell you these things because I hope you grow into a better person faster than I managed to. 🙂💜

[–] Gaywallet@beehaw.org 8 points 1 year ago (1 children)

One other bit to add here to this fantastic post - sometimes people like to over-correct their speech, and it's actually a form of deflection. The classic example of this is "I don't see race" when talking to someone bringing up an issue with bigotry. Often times people are trying to quickly get across that they don't think they're racist or that this wouldn't happen or apply to how they think. But it's also a lie, they do see race, what they meant to say is that they don't use race for a determination of value or to discriminate in this context.

To make it really clear why it's a wrong statement, in case anyone doesn't see how it's an over correction, is to imagine it's another characteristic such as ability. Would you tell a person in a wheelchair that you 'don't see disability'? An unhoused individual that you 'don't see income/housing'? A divorced person that you 'don't see marriage'? These are real human characteristics and attributes, they absolutely exist and we shouldn't focus on erasing them.

[–] millie@beehaw.org 2 points 1 year ago

I see this happening so often and it honestly just baffles me. It costs nothing to actually take the time to care and to acknowledge when things aren't the way they should be. Even when you screw up yourself, the outcome is soo much better so quickly when you're willing to just say "I hadn't thought of that, I didn't mean to make things worse", or "you're right, that sucks". Just that acknowledgement makes such a big difference.

People are terrified of acknowledging any sort of privilege or discrimination or even just significant difference sometimes, maybe because they feel like it'll make them feel like they're on the outside or something? But acknowledging oppression in a world that denies it is exactly what puts you on the same page with other people when they're suffering, not joining in on insisting that everything is fine.

It's so much easier not to be a jerk. But I think people get caught up in this idea that their thoughts in any given moment are the be all and end all of what they are. Growth isn't permissible because growth implies that something is wrong in the first place. I suppose in a punitive-minded society it makes some sort of sense.

[–] HappyMeatbag@beehaw.org 1 points 1 year ago* (last edited 1 year ago)

Wow. That was extremely well put. It’s hard to deliver a critique on such a sensitive topic without sounding judgmental, but you managed it perfectly.

Thank you for including the video, as well! It really helped illustrate your point.