this post was submitted on 20 Jan 2024
919 points (96.2% liked)
Lemmy Shitpost
26838 readers
3838 users here now
Welcome to Lemmy Shitpost. Here you can shitpost to your hearts content.
Anything and everything goes. Memes, Jokes, Vents and Banter. Though we still have to comply with lemmy.world instance rules. So behave!
Rules:
1. Be Respectful
Refrain from using harmful language pertaining to a protected characteristic: e.g. race, gender, sexuality, disability or religion.
Refrain from being argumentative when responding or commenting to posts/replies. Personal attacks are not welcome here.
...
2. No Illegal Content
Content that violates the law. Any post/comment found to be in breach of common law will be removed and given to the authorities if required.
That means:
-No promoting violence/threats against any individuals
-No CSA content or Revenge Porn
-No sharing private/personal information (Doxxing)
...
3. No Spam
Posting the same post, no matter the intent is against the rules.
-If you have posted content, please refrain from re-posting said content within this community.
-Do not spam posts with intent to harass, annoy, bully, advertise, scam or harm this community.
-No posting Scams/Advertisements/Phishing Links/IP Grabbers
-No Bots, Bots will be banned from the community.
...
4. No Porn/Explicit
Content
-Do not post explicit content. Lemmy.World is not the instance for NSFW content.
-Do not post Gore or Shock Content.
...
5. No Enciting Harassment,
Brigading, Doxxing or Witch Hunts
-Do not Brigade other Communities
-No calls to action against other communities/users within Lemmy or outside of Lemmy.
-No Witch Hunts against users/communities.
-No content that harasses members within or outside of the community.
...
6. NSFW should be behind NSFW tags.
-Content that is NSFW should be behind NSFW tags.
-Content that might be distressing should be kept behind NSFW tags.
...
If you see content that is a breach of the rules, please flag and report the comment and a moderator will take action where they can.
Also check out:
Partnered Communities:
1.Memes
10.LinuxMemes (Linux themed memes)
Reach out to
All communities included on the sidebar are to be made in compliance with the instance rules. Striker
founded 1 year ago
MODERATORS
you are viewing a single comment's thread
view the rest of the comments
view the rest of the comments
Wait he was handed live gun, which was supposed to fire blanks and yet it's him getting charged and not the propmaster. what the fuck? what am I missing?
It's never as simple as you think.
Analysis of the events and circumstances, and commentary by a lawyer: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wXmAeMQCvZQ
He says that Baldwin is unlikely charged for firing the gun but more likely for being a producer who failed to ensure that the set is safe.
The thing is that he right now is being charged for firing the gun not for falling as a producer, that's why it seems pretty weird like they are really trying to sack him for some reason.
When you fire a gun, and it hits someone, you can't be that surprised when you are charged with that.
You absolutely can if you have every reason to believe it's not firing a live round, like say, on a film set, where all weapons are supposed to be cleared with armorers/prop masters.
... and the actors. At least, that has been reported as the usual way.
I love me some Legal Eagle, but this video is 2 years old and at the beginning he says they don't have the full facts yet and everything is speculative since they don't know what happened. I'm wondering if there's anything more recent with more info about what actually happened.
Legal Eagle? Let's french this up a bit and call him L'Eagle.
So, there is a part where he's an executive producer and may have ignored warnings regarding safety.
According to a Wikipedia article on the incident it was the armorer that had previous experience with accidental discharges of firearms and I guess it's the mere point of their presence during filming to make sure all guns are handled safely. Their job was to hand a safe gun to the actor, they didn't do it and a person died. I don't fucking see one reason to charge the actor, regardless of whether they happen to be a producer or not, and not charge the person actually responsible for the accident.
He was the armorer’s boss, and the producer, so it was his job to make sure everything was as required. He failed his responsibilities, someone died. It’s pretty simple.
It's maddening the amount of people deflecting responsibility off of him. If a workplace safety incident happened, and the boss has cultivated the lax culture against safety AND is involved with said incident, but he's not responsible? I feel like I'm taking crazy pills.
Tbh, my first reaction was that it wasn’t fair; then I read more details as they were reported and had a moment of clarity. People get comfortable and mess up, it happens. This time, it cost someone their life.
For those worried about Alec, he has plenty of money. His ego and wallet will take a hit, but he’s not going to prison. He may or not be in a mental prison, but he can afford quality therapy, so if he is and chooses to stay there, that’s on him.
I went on exactly the same path as you and I only read about it when I came across the articles casually browsing, I didn't actively seek them out.
There are people that knew more and are still defending him, which is wild.
I hear you. He can still be a decent person who made a serious mistake due to gross negligence. I’m not saying he is or isn’t decent; I like s lot of past things he said, and I hope this was a wake up call for all of us: If we’re coasting too long on good reputation/intention/feelings, we’re going to get hard reminders to actually continue working to be better than we were, yesterday.
I'm basing what I say on the Wikipedia article and the two years old Legal Eagle video, but it seems it wasn't his negligence, but rather the armorer's and the assistant producer's:
Btw, holy fucking shit I hate lawyers
Literally no one is worried about him as a driving force bud, if you think thats the concern or topic of discussion you should probably sit it out
Perhaps because Baldwin, as far as we know, did everything correctly? He had the armorer prepare the gun and assistant producer check it. The armorer failed to do it correctly and the assistant producer failed at their part of the job. They are guilty of the accident, because they did not follow the procedure required, not the person who gave them the task
No one is absolving responsibility from the armourer.
But if I'm the boss of a warehouse, never enforce any OSHA safety standards against my staff, and one of them just signed off that they inspected the forklift that day without actually doing so, and I drove the forklift and killed someone because of the forklift's malfunction, I am, as the boss, partly responsible for the incident.
To say otherwise is flying against rules and regulations written in blood, as we can clearly see.
How does this even apply to the situation?
Baldwin is one of the producer (boss), who did not enforce any safety standards (allowed crews to bring live ammo to the set, allowed armourer to be subpar), and ended up with one of his staff dead.
If you don't know how my analogy applies to the situation you clearly don't know enough about it to form an informed opinion.
ALL workplace safety standards should be the responsibility of the boss in some capacity. That's how safety standards are maintained. If the boss is allowed to shrug it off saying "it's not my fault the staff is an idiot" that's how we end up with new hires dying on the line. If you can't understand that I could only hope you aren't in charge of anyone's safety.
It's not that simple because there were a lot of producers and we don't know what his involvement in her hiring was. A producer can do anything from practically everything to literally nothing.
Lol! He was also the actor handling the weapon! We aren’t privy to grand jury evidence, so we’ll have to wait and see. I found this, for anyone interested. https://apnews.com/article/what-to-know-alec-baldwin-grand-jury-60eaa895deee6e762281d575bc4f75b3
Pity he didn’t insist on everyone being safe. I’m still musing the fact that live ammunition was even where it could possibly have been confused with blanks; I’m wondering if anyone has hired a PI to investigate Ms. Guiterrez and other cast and crew who may have had any grudges or other hm, conditions, that may have led to such an unfortunate accident. Or Baldwin himself. I’m not sure about LE investigating every angle, at all. In 2021, Baldwin had a net worth of ~$61 mn.
I looked and found this article, as well: https://www.distractify.com/p/alec-baldwin-net-worth. I would hope Mr. Baldwin has competent counsel and a competent PI. Nonetheless, he’s been charged, and I do understand the charges. All we can do is send best wishes, and see how it plays out in court. I’m sure any fan mail support that’s not inauthentic expressing solidarity and support would be appropriate and appreciated.
As an aside, seven kids. My heart goes out to his family.
I think it would be fair to charge him with reckless endangerment if he was involved with her hiring and there were clear red flags, but producers have extremely varied roles and I don't know what his personal involvement was.
Clear red flags, you say? https://www.latimes.com/entertainment-arts/business/story/2021-10-22/alec-baldwin-rust-camera-crew-walked-off-set
I agree the set was a mess and whoever was in charge of that side should definitely be charged for endangerment. I don't know if the most responsible person was Baldwin though, because there were a lot of producers involved and being labeled a producer doesn't mean you actually do anything. It's possible that he had more involvement, but I don't want to make that assumption based on the title of producer alone.
I do think he should have used his influence to do more to make the set safe, no matter what his responsibilities were, and that he was irresponsible in that regard no matter what, but not doing enough isn't necessarily criminal if he wasn't the directly responsible individual.
I meant red flags before she was hired, but she should have been fired immediately after these things happened, I agree.
Let the legal system do its thing. The prosecutor will still have to convince a jury beyond a reasonable doubt of the crime they allege he committed.