this post was submitted on 28 Nov 2023
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We're a group of activists in a Western country where most have been brought up with either "Israel = good, Hamas = bad" or "It's a sad, but unsolvable conflict between two equal sides". The media heavily skewed to the Israeli perspective, and our politicians want to condemn protests in support of Palestinians. Therefore, unless you purposefully seek out information on what's going on in Palestine, you won't really encounter information about the occupation, the apartheid or the human rights violations. There are a lot of gaps in people's information and understanding of the situation.

Atm there's a lot of dehumanization, a lot of "Well, what can you do? Hamas keeps attacking Israel, what are they supposed to do?". I think the Israel=Good is deep-rooted in a lot of westerners. I know it was in me.

We've asked ourselves and each other what finally broke through our previous perception, so we could see the inequality and realize that what's happening is not right

One mentioned seeing a journalist in the back of an ambulance being handed a one-year-old that had passed

One mentioned seeing a video of a caring father saying goodbye to his little girl, kissing her eyes before she was wrapped in the materiale they wrap their dead. The father clearly in denial, smiling and wishing for her to wake up.

A big one for me was being told that it's not an equal fight. It's not two equally strong countries. It's one country with a huge military, and another with barely any. Another was hearing about the human rights violations that's been going on for decades - the fabricated water shortage, the children in Israeli jails.

I believe these are the moments we need to collect and present to those who are still wary on where they stand.

What broke through to you?

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[–] DarkGamer@kbin.social -2 points 9 months ago

My experience was the opposite, I started out more sympathetic to Palestine until I learned more about the conflict. When I hear the UN and human rights agencies call Israel genocidal, an apartheid state, and ethnic cleansers, it made it seem like they are the bad guys until I read up on it. I no longer think these definitions are accurate, at least not how they are commonly used, (these definitions depend on treating a national group like an ethnic group and ignoring the fact that they remain violently belligerent, and that these same ethnic groups exist within Israel with full legal rights.)

Then I learned about the history of this conflict, and how Palestinian Arabs started the violence which led to their present situation, (most notably they instigated all the earliest massacres in Mandatory Palestine making a one-state solution impossible & starting the cycle of violence in earnest, declared war on Israel in '48 and lost, and intended to invade in the six-day war and were defeated.) When their forces were the victors they mortared civilians indiscriminately and drove every Jew from Jerusalem and the West Bank. Their sympathizers drove Jews from the Muslim world. When given free elections they elected Hamas, who is explicitly genocidal. I can't help but find it ironic when they accuse Israel of similar behaviors and plead for international actors to stop them.

I also take great issue with Palestinian behaviors and popular opinion regarding women's equality, LGBT rights, support of Intifada/genocide/denying rights to Jews, extreme religiosity, and treatment of Atheists and apostates. As a bisexual man I cannot support a regime that would throw me in prison or off a building for being who I am.

Today I see Palestine as a belligerent nation that was defeated overwhelmingly yet refuses to concede, is abhorrent when it comes to civil rights, and wants to continue endless terror attacks against Israel despite having no hope in winning militarily. They have instead chosen to keep fighting a fruitless war of terror against an enemy they cannot defeat, ensuring the cycle of violence continues indefinitely.

There are certainly valid criticisms of Israel as well, but their civil rights record is far better and their society more tolerant. I find the spike in support on the left for would-be genociders with a mediaeval mindset to be baffling and disheartening. They oppose what the left stands for.

A big one for me was being told that it’s not an equal fight. It’s not two equally strong countries

Why does the fact that this war is asymmetrical matter? Should they not retaliate because their retaliation would be too effective? At one time Israel was the underdog, and their cause hasn't changed. They want safety.