this post was submitted on 05 Nov 2023
1244 points (93.2% liked)
Leftism
2085 readers
4 users here now
Our goal is to be the one stop shop for leftism here at lemmy.world! We welcome anyone with beliefs ranging from SocDemocracy to Anarchism to post, discuss, and interact with our community. We are a democratic community, and as such, welcome metaposts that seek to amend the rules through consensus. Post articles, videos, questions, analysis and more. As long as it's leftist, it's welcome here!
Rules:
- Absolutely no fascism, right wing extremism, genocide denial, etc.
- Unconditional support of authoritarians will not be tolerated
- Good faith discussion about ideologies is encouraged, but no sectarianism
- No brocialism/sexism
- No ableism
- No TERFs/ anti-LGBTQ+ rhetoric
- No racism
- No trolling
- No insults, dunking, or personal attacks
- No posting of misinformation, disinformation, or fake news
- Mods have final say
Posting Expectations:
- Comics/memes/shitposts/propaganda are only allowed on weekends
- Try to avoid liberalism unless discussing electoral politics. Even then, try to focus on tactical agreement towards leftist goals
- Only one meta post seeking consensus per person per day
- Posts about a particular ideology are ok, but remember the rules above
- Remember that there is no “right way” to implement leftist theory. This rule does not prevent academic criticism.
- Try to avoid extremely sensitive topics unless approaching them with appropriate care for intersectionality. Use your best judgement, and be prepared to provide respectable sources when having these discussions. Wikipedia is not an acceptable source in these cases.
- Post titles must be meaningful and relevant, except on weekends
Sister Communities:
!abolition@slrpnk.net !antiwork@lemmy.world !antitrumpalliance@lemmy.world !breadtube@lemmy.world !climate@slrpnk.net !fuckcars@lemmy.world !iwwunion@lemmy.ml !leftymemes@lemmy.dbzer0.com !leftymusic@lemmy.world !privacy@lemmy.world !socialistra@midwest.social !solarpunk@slrpnk.net Solarpunk memes !therightcantmeme@midwest.social !thepoliceproblem@lemmy.world !vuvuzelaiphone@lemmy.world !workingclasscalendar@lemmy.world !workreform@lemmy.world
founded 1 year ago
MODERATORS
you are viewing a single comment's thread
view the rest of the comments
view the rest of the comments
I'm guessing facts won't work here. The "consequences" he's laughing about are a consistent >100% ROI on welfare. He's laughing because he's proud conservatives are hurting the economy (and even their own bank accounts!) by hurting the poor, either out of willful ignorance or willful malice.
Reactionaries are not hurting the economy.
They are hurting the working class, including themselves, while helping the oligarchs.
Why, you may ask, do they hurt themselves, and help the oligarchs?
The reason is that they always do what the man on the television screen tells them.
Weakening welfare hurts the economy. That's what he's laughing about. Welfare has always been the biggest no-brainer in economic theory. It always makes the country more than you spend. Even the wealthy.
Do you know many conservatives, for real? I'm not talking Trump-heads. I'm talking actual conservatives. There's this underlying attitude that the world is a "free" place where you work hard and earn your way to betterment. You hear it in the voices of the older generation, but also the newer generation, when they talk about things like "work ethic", or someone being "too proud to beg" when there's a disaster and family or friends try to offer help. Have you never heard anyone say "I don't want nothin for free", or tell their boss "I don't need that kinda money, just pay me ____ and I'll be happy"? I've seen and heard all those things.
One way to look at conservativism is that it's means based, where the Left is more ends based. A conservative cares more about "doing the right thing" than "making the world a better place", They see the government's place as "enforcing peace" and nothing else, so social programs seem like a giant mandated charity to them.
Conservatives rarely oppose welfare because they think it doesn't work. They oppose welfare because they think it's wrong whether it works or not. And that's not a talking head telling them that, it's decades of growing up surrounded by that same hierarchical mindset.
Like John F Kennedy said "Ask Not What Your Country Can Do For You. Ask what you can do for your country". There's people who take that to heart and feel it's not the country's job to make their life a better place. And will allow themselves to sink into poverty holding on to that belief.
They're horribly wrong, but if you don't understand why they feel that way, it's hard to help move the country forward.
There is no "The Economy".
Weakening welfare hurts workers.
There really is. Even without capitalism, the median buying power of an individual will always be a thing.
Obviously. It hurts everyone, so of course it hurts workers.
No. Weakening welfare helps the oligarchs.
Notice how they keep doing it.
Workers and oligarchs have mutually antagonist interests.
"The Economy" is a construct that obfuscates the class antagonism.
Actually, it doesn't. Strong welfare has created wealth for companies like Walmart. Regardless of intent, almost every law makes the Oligarchs richer.
Conservatives keep doing it. The Conservatives cater to the wealthy, but it isn't just the wealthy that guide the party's direction . The Fortune 500 find limited benefit shrinking welfare, but rich individuals (not super-wealthy) would rather an extra couple grand in their tax return, and conservative people hate the idea of someone getting something for nothing.
There's more than 2 categories of people in the world. It's not oligarchs voting against welfare. And most people voting against welfare come from a line of thought that predates Oligarchy in the US.
Calling something fiction doesn't make it so.
You are a troll, a reactionary posing as a leftist.
Your impersonation is weak and transparent.
You have no understanding of leftism more nuanced or accurate than would appear in any reactionary tropes.
You are trying to erase class struggle.
You object unrelentingly to every conceivable detail, in a desperate and pathetic attempt to construct a parity and partnership between workers and oligarchs.
Welfare was won by the blood of workers, not given by rulers by their own accord or for their own benefit.
Fuck off, and learn history, troll.