politics
Welcome to the discussion of US Politics!
Rules:
- Post only links to articles, Title must fairly describe link contents. If your title differs from the site’s, it should only be to add context or be more descriptive. Do not post entire articles in the body or in the comments.
Links must be to the original source, not an aggregator like Google Amp, MSN, or Yahoo.
Example:
- Articles must be relevant to politics. Links must be to quality and original content. Articles should be worth reading. Clickbait, stub articles, and rehosted or stolen content are not allowed. Check your source for Reliability and Bias here.
- Be civil, No violations of TOS. It’s OK to say the subject of an article is behaving like a (pejorative, pejorative). It’s NOT OK to say another USER is (pejorative). Strong language is fine, just not directed at other members. Engage in good-faith and with respect! This includes accusing another user of being a bot or paid actor. Trolling is uncivil and is grounds for removal and/or a community ban.
- No memes, trolling, or low-effort comments. Reposts, misinformation, off-topic, trolling, or offensive. Similarly, if you see posts along these lines, do not engage. Report them, block them, and live a happier life than they do. We see too many slapfights that boil down to "Mom! He's bugging me!" and "I'm not touching you!" Going forward, slapfights will result in removed comments and temp bans to cool off.
- Vote based on comment quality, not agreement. This community aims to foster discussion; please reward people for putting effort into articulating their viewpoint, even if you disagree with it.
- No hate speech, slurs, celebrating death, advocating violence, or abusive language. This will result in a ban. Usernames containing racist, or inappropriate slurs will be banned without warning
We ask that the users report any comment or post that violate the rules, to use critical thinking when reading, posting or commenting. Users that post off-topic spam, advocate violence, have multiple comments or posts removed, weaponize reports or violate the code of conduct will be banned.
All posts and comments will be reviewed on a case-by-case basis. This means that some content that violates the rules may be allowed, while other content that does not violate the rules may be removed. The moderators retain the right to remove any content and ban users.
That's all the rules!
Civic Links
• Congressional Awards Program
• Library of Congress Legislative Resources
• U.S. House of Representatives
Partnered Communities:
• News
view the rest of the comments
Oh my god; someone still selling the ridiculous narrative that these white supremacist fascists are being white supremacist fascists because of "economic anxiety"
https://www.nytimes.com/2018/04/24/us/politics/trump-economic-anxiety.html
What they fear is losing the privileged status of white supremacy in America; what they're desperate to stop is a more equal society. They didn't march demanding more pay, better working conditions, or more upward mobility in Charlottesville, they marched chanting "Jews will not replace us" and "blood and soil." They've been telling us, loudly, for years what it's all really about and people still want to believe it's about economics as if there weren't dozens of very well-off people arrested for trying to attack Congress on January 6th.
It's undeniable that more economic opportunity would shrink their pool of possible supporters, even if it would never eliminate that pool. We don't have to stop every from being a white supremacist; we just need to stop them from coming up with the power to topple our government.
This reminds me of a good saying. The worst enemy of progress is doing nothing while waiting for a perfect solution. I agree with you.
Not having anyone doing hateful things would be better, but that's a terrible reason to just let the problem grow.
Yeah, because they're fucking stupid and they don't know why they have poor pay, poor working conditions, and no upward mobility. They literally believe it's a conspiracy by Them to keep the white man down. They're dummies.
But that doesn't actually mean economic factors aren't the primary motivator. There's still an underlying, material problem.
They're no more stupid than leninists. Honestly both having roots being on the authoritarian end of the spectrum. They are an excellent mirror of each other. Having more in common than they are different realistically.
It's really isn't a problem of stupidity. More a problem of taking an ideology or way of thinking as the core of their personality. Combining that with an unwillingness to rationalize or change.
I consider myself more of a centrist. I think leninists and anarchists both have good ideas
It’s fine to recognize good ideas regardless of source, but politics is so much more than just ideas.
Centrism, especially at this point in time, may be the most dangerous political philosophy of all. After all, they will cast the decisive votes in 2024. The center of “democracy” and “no democracy” is “less democracy”.
Democratic Socialism isn't less democracy and anarchism definitely isn't less democracy so
In general I do not. Since realistically Libertarians, anarchists, etc share any of the good ideas leninists might have. Without embodying all the bad things leninists do. As long as were talking true libertarians, social-libertarians. And not the fash friendly, selfish neo-libertarians of privilege on the right.
Absolute power corrupts absolutely. No matter the intentions behind it.
What absolute power? Power to the people my dude!
A party that's socially suppresses the people does not represent the people. I say this about capitalism and leninism both. The party should only answer to the people. Not the other way round.
Like the farmers that under threat of the party. We're forced to listen to the lunatic ramblings of Trofim Lysenko. Discarding what they knew would work to follow his unfounded recommendations. Exacerbating famines in Russia China Etc killing Millions. Committees and councils are absolutely bad about inaction. But inaction on genocide and torture I'll take that any day.
As we all know, famine never happened before the revolution. 🙄
Nice deflection. There was Global famine happening. Yes it happened before. His policies specifically pushed by the party militantly exacerbated and killed Millions more people than would have otherwise died. But you can't face that fact. This is what I talk about no ability to be rational or self critique.
How was there a global famine happening if communism only emerged in one country at that point? Doesn't that strike you as odd?
Or are you one of those ultra left "everyone except for my sooper speshul ideology is bad!"?
No. Because that's a non sequitur claim that I never made.
No not at all. I can work with liberals and other right Wingers of their ilk. I disagree with them highly. But can work with it. It's the authoritarians and those who selfishly enable authoritarians for their own benefits that I don't get along with.
You definitely implied it by blaming communism in Russia for famine, when the famine itself was global.
Okay, so you don't really care about human suffering or death (or else the immense amounts of both under liberalism would bother you) You just don't like being told what to do.
To quote what I said exactly
Is it that English isn't your primary language? Lack of reading comprehension? Or is it just your inability as a Leninist to honestly accept genuine critique?
You quoted exactly what I said and then blatantly completely misrepresented it. To be honest I'm completely unsurprised. This is what we can expect from a leninist. Also you do realize that your critique against liberals is equally valid against you as a leninist and the Nations who have adopted your ideology. Two wrongs don't make right. However there is a distinct difference here. There are liberals who in general are not authoritarian. There are not however non authoritarian leninists. It is the core differentiator of your ideology from standard Marxism.
I'm fine with deferring to expertise and following instructions. However unlike yourself I am not a slave devoted to a single static ideology. And unable to think for myself. I am fine with a national government after a fashion. I think there should be a much more even distribution of power and tight restrictions on it. But I think that for instance one perfect example of an issue that needs to be addressed at a national level. Should be guaranteeing human rights. However I don't believe that level of government has any right restricting anything outside of protecting those guarantees. Something that yes liberals have issues with. Though not to the same extent as leninists.
lol what the fuck
Okay, so like, I was trying to point out the fact that famine being widespread means that the underlying cause is bigger than politics and ideology. No one knew what the fuck they were doing. There isn't some fatal flaw of Leninism that causes famine and is somehow unique to Leninism, that's just how agriculture was before scientific understanding advanced to the point that we could truly industrialize the agricultural industry.
I literally said I also think anarchists have good ideas, I wouldn't consider myself pure M-L or anything. Back off lol
lol
And what is to be done when there aren't any experts? When all the instructions you have to follow are folk wisdom and superstition? That's what the USSR was dealing with back then. Again, no one knew what the fuck they were doing. They weren't special. That's just how the world was.
And as we speak and without any centralized ideology the agricultural industry is destroying our world; emitting carbon and methane, polluting our drinking water, incubating new diseases, causing oceanic dead zones, inducing metabolic diseases like diabetes and obesity, deforesting and destroying habitat, on and on it goes.
How do you solve that without authority to crack down and force people to stop chopping down the Amazon and stop keeping pigs in tiny cages filled with shit?
Lysenko had less idea than anyone else about what they were doing. However he was promoted to the Soviet head of agriculture science. And his batshit crazy ideas were pushed by the party. Simply out of a feel-good desire because it aligned with their political beliefs. Literally forcing Farmers to plant the wrong things against their will. And even plow glass and other trash into the fields in China to increase soil volume. Those policies demonstrably made the famine worse. It happened everywhere else in the globe for the most part too but those places did not have tens of millions combined to compare with either Russia or China. And lessenko and the party is to thank for that.
Anarchists, libertarians, and even leninists have a lot of ideological overlap. We're socialists after all. Even if leninists are only nomally so. That doesn't mean you're a centrist. Because I'll tell you one area where we anarchist / Libertarians disagree with you wildly. The authoritarian Mono Party bullshit. That you as a solid ml are always around hypocritically pushing. Or that bullshit about Al Franken recently. Perhaps you should take your own advice.
Seriously. Research Lysenko. It was literally the parties's rejection of those exact things along with scientific method facts and reality. That compounded the famine and made them rack up the high score. Seriously stop ignoring what's being said or hand waving it away. I'm not repeating his name for my own health or sanity. It is a prime example of the failures of authoritarianism leninism included.
Did you fail to notice modern farming today is largely centrally owned and controlled? It's not a bunch of little disparate mom and pop shops. There is absolutely a central ideology behind it. Perpetual and impossible growth at all costs. With no focus on sustainability.
There is Authority Beyond threats of imprisonment or murder. This is the reason no one likes leninists. To a leninist winning a debate is my gun to your head or my tank in your face. It isn't about the strength, authority, or inherent value of your ideas. Often quite the opposite. It's how you end up with thin-skinned strong men like ole poppy Pooh Bear. Speaking of Xi what are your thoughts on the recent Naomi Wu situation? She had been one of the biggest ambassadors for technology and makers for China and Chinese companies. And giving a face to many of the often too faceless Chinese people. It sure was humanitarian of ole Xi's thugs to come threaten her and her partner for the mild criticisms she made. And I do mean mild. Seeing as how Wu had previously spent most of her life hiding from the party. Yet still generally supportive and apologetic of how China has been. It's a good thing China isn't bigoted/racist. With an axe to grind against lesbians like Wu or uighers like her partner.
I'm familiar with him (we learned about his failures in my highschool actually), but his ideas (while wrong) weren't all that much worse than the other dumb shit people believed.
I'll give you one thing, decentralized agriculture at least means every individual farmer is trying their own whacky shit and occasionally they get lucky. Central control destroys that. If the central ideas are bad, like the modern model of infinite growth at any cost, then the results are bad.
Fair - but that is liberalism. The ones you think you can work with. What's up with that?
They want centralized control over their image in the West (she had an English speaking audience after all), and she wasn't the image they wanted. Tragic collateral damage in a propaganda war.
They also have a backwards notion that queer people must be silenced to promote population growth - as if we aren't, ourselves, important family members that can help our straight brothers and sisters watch their kids.
Central control is good when the central ideas are good, it's bad when the central ideas are bad. I think that's pretty obvious. What's so hard to understand about that?
While we're on China, what are your thoughts on the fact that Chinese life expectancies have surpassed Americans?
"Extremism" Not just the fascists. If you can't see the correlation between the shrinking middle class over the past 4-5 decades and the growth of extremism, I'm not sure what to say to that. These morons are anxious, and a lot of that is economic, and historically it doesn't take much to point angry morons at the wrong target. Just define an "other" (Jews, Immigrants, LGBTQ) for them to focus on and they'll run with it. I'm not excusing these assholes at all. But fighting the symptoms and not the disease is not a smart way to go about making change.
Also, for what its' worth, I wanted to look at the article you posted, but I can't get past the paywall.