this post was submitted on 29 Aug 2023
90 points (88.8% liked)

Asklemmy

43893 readers
1067 users here now

A loosely moderated place to ask open-ended questions

Search asklemmy ๐Ÿ”

If your post meets the following criteria, it's welcome here!

  1. Open-ended question
  2. Not offensive: at this point, we do not have the bandwidth to moderate overtly political discussions. Assume best intent and be excellent to each other.
  3. Not regarding using or support for Lemmy: context, see the list of support communities and tools for finding communities below
  4. Not ad nauseam inducing: please make sure it is a question that would be new to most members
  5. An actual topic of discussion

Looking for support?

Looking for a community?

~Icon~ ~by~ ~@Double_A@discuss.tchncs.de~

founded 5 years ago
MODERATORS
you are viewing a single comment's thread
view the rest of the comments
[โ€“] kuneho@lemmy.world 13 points 1 year ago (4 children)

DS9. The Dominion is about to come through the wormhole with hundreds or thousands of ships and the prophets are like "omg Sisco you can't have a fucking war here, man, we need you later on" and Sisco was "fuck you, I do whatever I want, do your magic, I don't care, it's man's business" so Sisco wont retreat.

and then what happened?

The whole fucking Dominion fleet just disappeared, poof! like Sisco used some kind of cheat code.

fuck that.

anyway, it's not the scene itself that was bad, but man. that was so freaking cheap I think the whole show changed in me a little bit after that. still amazing series, tho

[โ€“] NuPNuA@lemm.ee 14 points 1 year ago (1 children)

One of DS9s driving themes from the pilot was deconstructing the almost militant atheism of TNG, exploring the nature of faith and how far people will go for it. A mortal man refusing the divine plan and choosing free will despite it meaning his own death and forcing them to save the Alpha Quadrant via Deus Ex Machina is totally in keeping with that theme.

[โ€“] kuneho@lemmy.world 3 points 1 year ago

really good point

[โ€“] morriscox@lemmy.world 6 points 1 year ago (1 children)

In Star Trek Online the fleet shows up years later and attack the station. They weren't destroyed just relocated in time (no pun intended).

[โ€“] PolandIsAStateOfMind@lemmy.ml 3 points 1 year ago* (last edited 1 year ago)

The prophets were legitly just as assholish as Q, but with less understanding of reality.

No wonder Bajorans worshipped them as gods.

[โ€“] Maalus@lemmy.world 4 points 1 year ago

I mean, all they had to do was use a previously established device - they had the minefield in place that was preventing the fleet from comming through. Could've involved the wormhole aliens in that so that it doesn't get destroyed when they think it has. Everything would've been the same, with Sisko unknowingly going into a minefield and the aliens trying to dissuade him from killing himself in a pointless fight

[โ€“] williams_482@startrek.website 1 points 1 year ago (1 children)

That scene is a triumph of Federation ideology.

Finding the wormhole was a lucky accident, but everything else which lead to that apparent deus ex machina came about from Starfleet doing exactly what was needed to get the Prophets on their side: not with the intention or expectation of that ultimate result, but because it slotted right in with what the Federation wants to do anyway.

Sicko and his crew communicate with these strange life forms in they find, and make an effort to not only understand them but respect their wishes. They offer enormous practical support to Bajor and attempt to encourage them to join the Federation formally, but they respect the wishes of the Bajorans even when highly inconvenient (such as the abrupt pivot away from Federation membership that preceded the Dominion War). In short, Sisko and the government backing him legitimately earned the trust of both Bajor and the Prophets by being explorers, diplomats, and excellent allies. The military payoff they got is hardly the point, but they earned it.

Would any of the other races have earned the favor of the Prophets the way the Federation did? The Klingons, Romulans, and obviously the Cardassians would have taken over as brutal occupiers if they felt the need to get involved with Bajor at all. The Ferengi would have ruthlessly exploited Bajoran resources in their own way (which we know the Prophets were no fans of, see their temporary rewiring of Grand Nagus Zek), while the Borg would have simply consumed everything they found useful. Here, it's the uniquely decent actions and values of the Federation that win out.

[โ€“] kuneho@lemmy.world 1 points 1 year ago* (last edited 1 year ago)

I mean, I'm not saying that part was a mistake or anything like that, it's just when I first saw this whole "how do you turn this on" cobra car cheatcode like thing... only that scene was made me question for once that am I really watching Star Trek? it just felt off.

but granted, DS9 is a very different Star Trek. it's an amazing one. that's for sure.

and also granted I'm "just" at the 4th season of Voyager, not too much ago finished DS9.