this post was submitted on 25 Aug 2023
681 points (99.6% liked)
Climate - truthful information about climate, related activism and politics.
5238 readers
474 users here now
Discussion of climate, how it is changing, activism around that, the politics, and the energy systems change we need in order to stabilize things.
As a starting point, the burning of fossil fuels, and to a lesser extent deforestation and release of methane are responsible for the warming in recent decades:
How much each change to the atmosphere has warmed the world:
Recommended actions to cut greenhouse gas emissions in the near future:
Anti-science, inactivism, and unsupported conspiracy theories are not ok here.
founded 1 year ago
MODERATORS
you are viewing a single comment's thread
view the rest of the comments
view the rest of the comments
I don't agree with those metrics, and also the main response I could give is pretty much exactly the same as what I just said. Perhaps one of my problems is your phrasing: "You demand all of this pollution.". No, I sure as hell do not. If you were to say "consumers demand all of this pollution." that would be less confrontational, but still incredibly incorrect. Do individuals consume the products of industry? Yes, amazing conclusion you have there.
I personally didn't design the city in which I live to have no reasonable public transportation and it's fairly bizarre and insulting to say that the average person did. I was born into this insanity. Saying that I 'demand pollution' because the fossil fuel industry suppressed renewable energy while investing in polluting sources is similarly so wrong that it's insulting. I never at any time said "you know, rather than cloth diapers, people 40 years before I was born should start using weird plastic diapers they just throw away!" High-level people who operate companies absolutely choose to skimp on pollution control for their profits and convenience, not that of the public or their customers. Take mining waste for instance. Do consumers use the products? Yes. Do consumers choose personally to abandon mines and allow them to fill full of toxic acidic water and pollute the nearby waterways? Uh, no, the owners of the mines do.
I never at any time went to a grocery store and said "you know, when you sell a single banana, it sure would be nice if you put it on a styrofoam tray wrapped in plastic". I never at any time said "you know, rather than invest in solar, we should frack the shit out of eastern Colorado and SE New Mexico" or "tar sands oil is a really, really good idea!". And personally, i do seek to reduce my consumption and be efficient.
So for some reason you're blaming every individual for society being set up in such a way as to benefit oil and gas companies. Guess who arranged that: people who profit from and operate petroleum companies. Essentially your claim is that since all industry exists to benefit the end user (ignoring the owners/executives/employees benefits) that consumers are 100% responsible for everything. It's a ludicrous and highly confused way to view the world.
Alright, you might be more personally aware than others. You also gotta be aware of the responsibility of most consumers. Sales of large trucks and SUV's are on the rise. No one's electing people to design less car centric towns, most people want more car focused transportation. Renewable energy has not been supressed at all, in fact its cheaper and more efficient than ever and available for anyone to buy. I think consumers are the only ones that can stop this
I think you're wrong. Renewables were suppressed for a very long time by companies who stood to profit from them being suppressed. I think you're vastly underestimating the amount of political sway large corporations can have on politics.
Where I am we have two parties with near identical climate policies who both receive the majority of their funding from coal and gas companies and who both choose to debate about any other topic.
People have also been flooded with so much disinformation that even now some people still think climate change isn't real. Putting the responsibility on individuals instead of on the actual perpetrators of this mess is kind of ridiculous.
I do agree we're the only ones who can change it but we're not responsible for it.
https://www.eco-worthy.com/collections/100w-195w/products/100w-12v-monocrystalline-solar-panel
This doesnt look very suppressed to me. People just arent buying em.
We'll just forget all the misinformation and climate denialism these companies have funded for decades that stopped solar panels even being a thing until just recently.