Correct. And they absolutely can hold it. On the first try it took Russia months to take it, and I don't see how they can do that again, given all the troops that were involved are now in Kherson. But I guess we'll just have to see.

orderly and strategic withdrawal.

Lol no. Literally just take a look at https://twitter.com/UAWeapons and you'll see tons of abandoned and destroyed Russian vehicles. They were completely overwhelmed in Kharkiv and did not plan this. Of course it's not all precisely geolocatable but it has to come from somewhere.

This is a war of attrition

Correct. And majority of the Russian army is in Kherson with their back towards a river with no bridges. Supplies are limited and they are unable to move a meaningful amount of vehicles in or out of Kherson. This is completely unsustainable in the long term.

Even western media admits that the fighting is far more expensive on the Ukrainian side

It sure is expensive. But Kherson has tied so many russian resources that Ukraine now managed to steamroll through Kharkiv. It doesn't matter whether Kharkiv was just an orderly retreat (it wasn't) or a "sign of goodwill" (it wasn't) or a rout (it was), Ukraine just wants their territory back. And there is "steady" progress on Kherson too, at least more steady than LDPR progress on Pisky and Bakhmut

zero evidence that HIMARS have made any strategic impact

HIMARS is the reason Russian logistics are completely fucked in Kherson. It's also the reason for the rise in "smoking accidents" in ammo dumps on Russian occupied territory.

Russia has [..] MLRS systems comparable to HIMARS

So in Russias hands they do have strategic impact? Also please tell me the name. I'm looking for something with about 80km range, less than 10m deviation at max range, and which is actually used by Russia. So far I have only seen them use Kalibrs for comparable targets, and those are much more expensive than HIMARS rockets and easier to intercept. It's also questionable how many of those are still left.

I'm done with this thread, we both know this discussion won't reach a conclusion. I'm interested to see where our points will stand in another 6 months

[–] yogthos@lemmy.ml 9 points 2 years ago

Literally just take a look at

Explains a lot about your position given that you get your info from an Ukrainian propaganda account on Twitter 😂

And majority of the Russian army is in Kherson with their back towards a river with no bridges. Supplies are limited and they are unable to move a meaningful amount of vehicles in or out of Kherson. This is completely unsustainable in the long term.

Weird that Ukraine isn't making gains there if Russians are in such a dire position isn't it.

It sure is expensive. But Kherson has tied so many russian resources that Ukraine now managed to steamroll through Kharkiv.

Yes, Ukraine managed to steamroll uncontested territory. Quite the tour de force there just like the first Kharkov offensive.

HIMARS is the reason Russian logistics are completely fucked in Kherson. It’s also the reason for the rise in “smoking accidents” in ammo dumps on Russian occupied territory.

Except that there is zero indication that HIMARS played any role in Kherson or that Russian logistics are having any problems there. Meanwhile, attacks in Crimea were carried out by drones. Ukraine doesn't even have HIMARS missiles with the range to hit Crimea.

So in Russias hands they do have strategic impact?

What I actually said was that If HIMARS type systems make a strategic impact then Russia has an advantage in this area by virtue of having an order of magnitude more MLRS systems.

I’m done with this thread, we both know this discussion won’t reach a conclusion. I’m interested to see where our points will stand in another 6 months

Good, let's see what actually happens since it's pretty clear we're not going to convince each other of anything here.

[–] UnreliantGiant@lemmy.ml 3 points 2 years ago (1 children)

I just realized we're having a "serious" discussion on /c/memes right now. I'll just leave this here then

[–] cult@lemmy.ml 11 points 2 years ago (1 children)

this is a terrible meme lol. Not even because it's politics or anything. Just... flat

[–] UnreliantGiant@lemmy.ml 1 points 2 years ago (1 children)

Flat memes are the best

[–] pingveno@lemmy.ml 1 points 2 years ago

I prefer 3D memes