Not really. The privacy chain from worst to best is
- default Android
- IOS
- DeGoogled Android (LineageOS, GrapheneOS or similar)
this post was submitted on 15 Jun 2023
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Out of curiosity, how far apart would you say LineageOS and iOS are in terms of privacy?
Quite a bit. Apple is a "we collect it, we just dont let anyone else but us have it" where Lineage is more of a "we dont collect it and would have nobody to share it with if we did". Mind i am speaking of lineageos with no gapps package. Installing any gapps at all completely defeats the point
LineageOS itself is just as private as AOSP and the Google core stack you might flash along it.
I have not found my source yet but once I've read about some Google telemetry within AOSP but that might be less than iOS on default settings sends. With Google core services you will definitely have more data collected on the Android side though.
EDIT: LONG POST, my opinion are backed on years of interest in the topics as well as first hand experience.
I'll go Windows x Android first:
Windows is a privacy nightmare. You can try and fight it but you can and will break things along the way. So I'll basically advise you to use anything else.
Android in the other hand has some options to flash custom ROMs and thus you can change what's running. But you're stuck with /e/ OS if you want real privacy without giving up on almost everything Google, banking apps, etc. There are other Android forks but most of them focus on security, features, gimmicks, etc. So at least there you have a good amount of control. You can use Android with KDE Connect for actually good cross device features in my personal opinion.
macOS iOS:
These are fully controlled by Apple. Sure, Apple goes hard against 3RD PARTY tracking, but does not tell you you need to switch off 1st party tracking within multiple settings pages (own experience). There have been some reports about macOS sending hashes of photos from a local account with no iCloud login, but that was fixed quickly, even though I've been skeptical. But this video by Techlore actually explains things really good.
MY conclusion?
I'd say the most private would be Android x Linux with KDE Connect.
2nd place is iOS with proper settings x Linux with KDE Connect. (For real, this tool gets you cool cross device sync.)
3rd place would be iOS x macOS both on privacy friendly settings if you, like me, rely on proprietary stuff. Xcode and iOS development can only be done on macOS and thus I'll stick to this combo. Fedora will always have a special place in my heart and on my SSD though.
So which level of these you want to pick definitely come down to how much you rely on what software and what you can afford. I hope I could help.
Besides /e/ os, I would also recommend graphene and calyxos.
Calyxos works similar to /e/os in that it uses microg to get things working, but calyxos is more up-to-date and secure.
Graphene os uses sandboxed Google play, which sounds bad, but the play services is confined to its sandbox, basically graphene os will simply feed it garbage telemetry unless it is absolutely necessary for the system to function.
/e/ os supports more devices (not just pixel like the other two), have their own SSO cloud service based on Nextcloud, and they support device that is outside of the support period of manufacturer (this also hurts security, as firmware cannot be updated without the OEM supporting the phone). But there is always a trade-off between security and longevity, given that most OEM only support a phone for couple of years now.
Appreciate the detailed response! I’ll have to look into KDE Connect, never heard of it. I mentioned this in another comment, but I just installed Nobara last night. I may end up sticking with the iOS/Linux combo for a bit depending on how things go. The only real problem I have is that I game on PC, so Linux and MacOS are both sort of poor choices for that. At least they (especially Linux) are getting better, though.
I find them all to be too intrusive for my tastes. I use Graphene OS and Linux.
I'm clamoring for the day we get a proper Mobile Linux environment that hasn't been coopted by Google
very high level, you should at least read up and consider it. the amount of attempted telemetry coming off our windows laptop is probably 5x our mac laptop. there's a ton of variables in config, so i say 5x not as something scientific, but woah, half an order of magnitude.
this is desktop - no iphone here so can't speak to that, but suspect much less difference
If you want to switch anyway, why not graphene/calyxos with Ubuntu/mint/pop/fedora? They work on your current device, and much more private than iOS + macOS
I think graphene should be relatively painless, especially with sandboxed Google play. The only thing don't work is probably auto and pay. Calyxos is kind of the same story.
Linux distro has been working really well for me (I switched to windows from Linux at the end of college, and switch back to Linux again last year). The only thing that doesn't work is office and other industrial software. If you don't use Microsoft office extensively, then liberal office is a okay replacement. Only office is also very solid, but it is Russian software with few outside developers, so many people don't really trust it.
I actually tried Graphene on my Pixel 7. To be honest, it gave up a bit too much for me. While I’d call myself an enthusiast, I generally want my phone to function without too much fuss or hassle. It was a pain trying to get different apps and notifications working properly in GrapheneOS, and I used Android Auto/CarPlay on a daily basis. It’s a great project, just not for me. I also got rid of the Pixel 7 as I was having non-OS related issues with it. As for the desktop/laptop, I actually just installed Nobara yesterday, as my win11 install decided to grenade itself. I’m definitely considering keeping it permanently, but time will tell as I game on my PC, and obviously that can be a bit difficult (though it’s getting easier with Proton and other supporting software).
Yeah Proton and linux gaming will only get better over time. Valve is heavily invested in getting this really good. And regarding the Android experience, I can only tell you that Google keeps trying to cripple the non Google experience even further. They just tried getting rid of Aurora Store and thus of getting Play Store apps without the Play Store. I just hope Aurora can keep operating just as it did until now.
Wow, I wasn’t aware of the Google stuff. Can’t say it’s terribly surprising though. Have you used any of the Proton suite? I’ve been considering switching to them from Gmail and OneDrive.
Yes, ProtonMail is really good, I just missed the desktop bridge. It is a reality now but it's not part of the free tier. I can't really complain about them except for the icon design. They do not feel at home on iOS haha
I just have to confess I still use my outlook mail as my main because there is so much legacy stuff connected to it like Xbox games, Minecraft, two movies,... But I use Anon Addy to alias it most of the time. That's why I can't really give you a better impression about the Proton suite
I think the proton he refers to is the proton compatibility layer developed by valve.
But I personally haven't switched to protonmail because they require Google to work on Android, which is surprising for a privacy company. On the other hand, Megasync also requires Google to work.
Tutanota don't, but I cannot use them in thunderbird.
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