cross-posted from: https://lemmy.ml/post/5531003
A follow up from my previous post on book 1
I do have to apologise ... this rant turns out to be pretty negative
So finished book 2 last night, just writing some off the cuff thoughts.
Thoughts on the show
First, I think I'm settled now in being a show fan first, which I'm sure is odd or strange for many book fans. But, for the first two books, I prefer the show and think it's doing a good job at adapting the books. Reading the books after seeing the show has made me miss things the show did and understand the challenge the show has had not just with compressing things into a tight TV schedule but managing the difficulties of adapting these books which include, IMO, pretty glaring flaws or at least awkward elements. Unfortunately, I've now got a pretty clear prejudice against book fans that heavily criticised or hated the show ... with all of the understanding/sympathy in the world, I think they just weren't ready to watch an adaptation and weren't being reasonable about how good or bad the first two books are.
Rest of season 2
Otherwise, for the rest of season 2, I'm in a curious position. I know how the second book ends, and so can see some of where the show is headed, but it's also going in some other directions almost certainly influenced by later books. I'm guessing it's bringing in a lot of book 3, and from what I can tell about where book 3 sits in the series (IE, it was supposed to be shorter and kind of wraps up this opening act of the series) I'm guessing it's going to try to wrap adapting all of book 2 and 3 ... so in a way I don't really know what's going to happen, which is cool, except I'm betting Egwene gets rescued and maybe something about Fain gets revealed? Will we get a battle in the sky though, will Lanfear kinda help Rand??
Thoughts on the book itself
So, for me, I lump book 2 along with book 1. Overall, it's a somewhat clumsy and seemingly rushed intro into the world and the series, probably written under a cloud of doubt and with an urge to publish quickly. I rank book 2 lower than book 1, largely because I don't think it achieves much and feels a lot like set up and info dump without a clear purpose or coherent story in its own right. For me, the sudden appearance of Moraine at the end, after Lanfear's sudden appearance and revelation, both with some info dump, along with Rand just jumping around the map without any real clear reason as to why it was happening, was all rather telling.
Reading it, I got the impression that the book was the clumsy/bad adaptation of the show (honestly serious). Like, Rand magically falling into the portal world and having a slightly B-tier fantasy sequence with Selene, who was obviously dodgy and likely lanfear, seemed like a cheap vehicle to get Rand to Cairhien. The portals then seemed like a cheap mechanism to get Rand to Falme while also being able to have the revelation of Machin Shin kinda following him. The whole multiple worlds and multiverse of timelines seems like it was supposed to be telling us something, at least thematically, maybe leading up to Rand's certainty that he's never sided with the dark one in a past life. But it never hit for me ... all I can hope for is that it comes up again in the series. The deal with Fain being mysteriously evil and yet not concluding it in anyway through plot in the book to then be clarified by a Moraine info dump, again felt like Jordan just needed this to be clear for later stories and didn't quite know how to do it.
Despite the kinda cringey super saiyan deus ex machina ending of book 1 ... we get ... another super saiyan ending in book 2? Fighting in the sky with magic swords or something again? Despite having blown the horn, the outcome of the battle still somehow depended on Rand winning the match? Also, somehow, out of no where, Rand is a master swordsman against Turak (and Ba'alzamon)? In the first book, I guess we can infer that the ending was intended by Ba'alzamon ... but I don't know what I'm supposed to glean from his fight in book 2 ... is Rand just powerful now without much explanation cuz "Dragon" ... cuz that's how it feels.
Personally, these are not satisfying endings, and the ending of season 1 compares rather favourably to both of the first two book endings. For a series that is celebrated for its magic system, and by implication not having a bad soft magic system, the first two books literally end with Rand being able to do things mostly involving flying in the sky like Goku that make no sense and have no set up other than "it's his fate to fight in the final battle". I say that as someone who's rather fond of soft magic systems ... but this literal deus ex machina stuff is the cardinal sin of soft magic and is not working for me it all. Like when the horn was blown, and hereos came out of nowhere swearing allegiance to Rand, even though that's what the horn is supposed to do ... and then Ba'alzamon appears out of nowhere and Rand starts fighting ... I was honestly thinking ... "really?!"
Sense of the series over all
I'm hoping my general contextual critique is accurate, and that these first 3 books are really an introduction that aren't representative of the series because they weren't written with the knowledge that the series was going to happen.
I always set out to read at least up to book 4 (and hopefully book 6), as many say that's when the series actually starts (I'm guessing it's the beginning of the second act of the series) ... and I will still do so ... as the first two books have definitely set up a very interesting world that I'm a fan of already.
Looking ahead though, I'm starting to wonder about the series as a whole. The slog is well known (however controversial), and I'm already starting to write off books 1-3. So, it's a 14 book series, where 1-3 are clumsy/flawed set up (my critique ATM) and 7-10 are "slog", leaving 4-6 and 11-14 ... so it's a more or less conventional double trilogy book series?? I know I'm being harsh here (and uninformed!!), and maybe I'm just bitter from book 2, but I'm starting to wonder how much the whole "the series doesn't start until book 4, oh and there's a slog 3 books later" is way too casually brushed off ... like I think I would have preferred a greater warning about what books 1 and 2 are and feel somewhat mislead. Maybe I just don't like Jordan's style ... I'm definitely curious to find out, but I feel like the first two books have structural issues that deserve (from the little I've seen) more commentary.
Back to the show
Thing is, as I said, I'm a show fan first, and it's actually the show that has set up the world for me with the books kind of being an awkward supplemental of additional detail.
For instance, Egwene in Falme is awesome in the show, and it felt like Jordan didn't quite appreciate the depth of the character moment he had created, with her being tortured etc kinda being brushed over as mostly info dump ... except of course when Egwene is free and loses her shit, which was a very nice way of clearly showing the effect of her experience, but also felt somewhat contrived because we had to infer how bad it must have been for her. In the show, if they free her, I am going to feel her liberated rage when she realises what vengeance she can do.
Generally, the character development of the girls is wonderful in the show and Jordan's treatment shows its sexism age. THe amount of talk of who gets to marry Rand, as well as hair combing ... was pretty cringe. Also, the seanchan do not come off as brutal in this book as I think book fans remember, it's often very after the fact when I feel like at least one clear depiction would have been rather impactful.
Fleshing out Liandrin and Moraine and Lanfear in season 2 has been awesome as well ... really smart choices it seems. Even leaving out Perrin's wolfbrother stuff with Elyas until season 2 seems smart in hindsight as he is pretty much not a focus of book 2.
General story thoughts and questions
Ok, so what was ba'alzamon's plan? Without getting into more critique of the books, because I could be really off base here ... but either the book is being intentionally mysterious, or I totally missed something, but I did not feel like ba'alzamon was a threat in this? Is the idea that many things surprised him ... Fain's extra double shadow nature ... Lanfear's interference ... Mat blowing the horn? When Ingtar revealed he was the darkfriend I had already forgotten about the prologue and that he was the obvious candidate ... largely I think because it really wasn't clear that any plan was pushing things around too much.
Putting the show together with the books ... I'm guessing it's a relatively big reveal later on in the books that the dark one is actually just Ishamael (which has been fairly clearly hinted at in the books). The show seems to have no cared for that mystery too much (which I've liked) ... I'm curious to see where it goes and for what purpose in the books.
I'm pretty sure it's me ... but I am not feeling the whitecloaks at all as an element of the world. Their involvement in book 2 was confusing to me ... did I miss something? But also, I guess I just don't like Fanatical Christian tropey stuff.
From book 1, I was always curious if Shadar Logoth and the Ways would become things ... and I'm pleased to see that they are. Fain being a Shadar creature, that is so against the dark that it is its own kind of dark is super cool to me. And Machin Shin and Siadin are some sort of thing ... right?! That the seanchan are an alternative forked culture was also super cool ... I just wish it was more fleshed out in some way ... and I'm guessing they come back and are a permanent part of the world.
Generally, as any WoT fan probably things, the diversity of cultures and angles especially on what "the dark" even is wonderful! Going on from that, I feel like the book is trying to hint at me that the relationship between the Dragon and the Dark is not so clear cut. For instance, I wouldn't be surprised if there's a revelation that Ishamael and the Dragon have had their roles reversed in previous ages. This is probably what's keeping me in the series the most ... what is Jordan going to do with his "evil" and "hero" dynamic here.