this post was submitted on 23 Sep 2023
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Videos

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[–] xNIBx@kbin.social 1 points 1 year ago* (last edited 1 year ago)

Some notes/corrections

  1. It kinda tries to tie the creation of Turkey with the genocide of armenians. And while it isnt completely wrong, the implied timeline and involvement of Ataturk is wrong.

  2. The far right greekcypriot organization EOKA B, overthrew the democratically elected, greekcypriot government of Cyprus. Their objective was unification with Greece, something that even the democratically elected government supported a few years ago but then stopped pursuing because of international pressure. So the dictatorship in Greece decided to overthrew the cypriot government in order to execute that initial plan(also we cant have anyone even slightly left leaning governing Cyprus, that would be absurd, fuck democracy).

EOKA B did some light ethnic cleansing of turkcyprtiots. Turkey was a guarantee nation of the independence treaty of Cyprus(along with Greece) and you could make a legal case that this gave them the right to intervene and stop the ethnic cleansing. This is what most turks believe happened. You could even say that the turks were morally obligated to intervene.

What many turks ignore was that Turkey invaded Cyprus twice. The first invasion, occupied 4% of Cyprus. This set in motion a series of events which extremely quickly led to the collapse of the dictatorship in Greece and their puppet EOKA B in Cyprus. Democracy was returning to both Greece and Cyprus. So there wouldnt be a unification or ethnic cleansing anymore. These events took place within weeks/months.

Of course, there were still issues to be solved regarding Cyprus(turkcypriots having veto power, etc) but at least the immediate threat of violence mostly ended there. Diplomatic talks were taking place.

Turkey seeing that their "opportunity window" was closing(they wouldnt have a reason to invade/occupy Cyprus anymore), they decided to initiate the second invasion, which lead to the occupation of 40% of Cyprus.

And this is when everyone lost their shit. If you are wondering why only Turkey recognizes Northern Cyprus and why "everyone hates Turkey, even though Turkey only wanted to protect ethnic turks", this is why. Because at that point, literally everything was going great FOR EVERYONE but Turkey decided "no, fuck you, i want a better hand in the following negotiations and i am willing to use military force".


Turkey is not a normal country. A normal country would try to negotiate about Kasterlorizo(greek island)'s insanely large EEZ shadow, which i agree is kinda absurd. But Turkey literally went "you know what? Fuck islands, i'll make my own international laws with hookers and oil. Islands dont deserve any EEZ, in fact half of Greece should be part of Turkey's EEZ".

Erdogan is wannabe Putin and the russian invasion of Ukraine is one of the best things that could have happened to Greece. It showed that no matter the integration and the cost, authoritarians are gonna authoritarian because they perceive cooperation as weakness. They think everyone but them is soft and weak and once they show their true power level(go full retard), noone will be able to defend against them.

Greece was one of the biggest proponents of Turkey's EU ascension. Greece was even willing to throw Cyprus under the bus just to normalize the relation with Turkey. Greece supported the UN's proposal for Cyprus, even though it was clearly disadvantageous because the expectation was that if Turkey becomes a "normal" country, the negative parts of the plan wouldnt be relevant, Cyprus could be like Belgium. Fortunately the greekcypriots voted against that plan.

Hopefully, the West's strong reaction to the ukranian invasion should discourage Erdogan from doing anything stupid. And please, dont tell me about the millions of "liberal" turks who would strongly oppose that, i dont care. The same way ukranians dont care about the millions of "liberal" russians living in Moscow and St Petersburg. They dont have any political or military power to do anything. They protested at the start, got beaten up and imprisoned and accused as traitors of the nation. If shit goes down, i expect the same thing to happen to "liberal" turks.

Opposition to things is not that relevant in authoritarian states. Turkey isnt as authoritarian as Russia, at least not yet but still. Ultimately, even Erdogan's opposition is pretty hawkish.