this post was submitted on 15 Jul 2023
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Well, Tesla is publicly traded, makes money, and clearly their cars work because they have lower than average road fatalities. With the disparity of how badly Twitter's being run vs Tesla I wonder how long it's been since Elon's actually been in charge of anything other than being a spokesperson for Tesla.
@Catch42
@kuontom @const_void
No one really knows if Tesla makes money. It's been long noticed that Musk is extremely dishonest and could easily be faking all of the numbers.
It's a public company, there are legal requirements for reporting its cash flows to its shareholders. If they're being fudged to that degree then that's massive fraud and Musk would be in very serious legal trouble.
@FaceDeer
@kuontom @const_void @Catch42
We live in the age of fraud. It's easy to fake those numbers. Hell, the regulations will even help you defraud investors. In fact, you should google Wirecard as an example of this, and realize it could totally happen again. Also, look at how rich Musk already is and realize he has already gotten away with it. Legal trouble just means he may retire in slightly less comfort than he would've anyways.
Don't understand how public companies work, do ya?
To be fair, they've got the killed-or-injured-by-a-software-driven-vehicle market virtually cornered.
They are among the most unreliable cars.. lol
And fewest fatalities because they are not selling as well as a honda civic..
fatalities statistics are based on % not absolute number
Exactly. If I start a brand of cars that explode as soon as you turn the ignition but only sell one, suddenly my brand has the fewest fatalities.
Are you sure about that?
Yes, because rising road fatalities and having lower than average road fatalities are not mutually exclusive. Radar-era autopilot was incredibly safe, so even though Elon made the stupid decision to make it vision-based which has caused fatalities to go up, they're still below average. You can check NHTSA's ratings just type in Tesla in the search bar and you'll see that they've gotten a 5 star rating on every car in every category.
Of course if you look at Tesla's own data they claim to the orders of magnitude safer, which I'm sure is only possible with some creative data manipulation, but it's silly to claim that Tesla's are less safe than average.
The NHSTA ratings are based on crash tests. Not real world accident statistics.
You didn't read your own link but did you read the article I linked to (and ideally the WaPo article it links to, for more detail)?
If so, I ask again, are you sure about that?.
I read both articles you have linked to, I don't think either of them contradict what I said. Both articles point out that Tesla dominate automation related accidents, which makes sense because Tesla has a far greater number of automation equipped cars on the road than other manufacturers. Furthermore they point out that those accidents have risen dramatically over the past few years. If you look at the graph on the WaPo article you linked to you'll see it's in agreement with what I said since Tesla switched to vision based systems in mid 2021.
Both articles point out that it is not possible to calculate because Tesla is withholding some of the necessary data (and has asked the NHSTA to redact the rest).
The WaPo gets closest to naming all the data you would need (miles driven in FSD; type of road being driven on) but you'd also need to match it to the Tesla owner demographic (wealthy, white, middle-aged men), and cars with an NHSTA 5 rating for structural safety.
I have no doubt that most of the autopilot miles driven are in Teslas, thanks to Musk's reckess promotion of it as FSD.
To know whether the technology fails more or less often than other autopilot systems, you would need data that Tesla are withholding, and much more detailed data on other cars than you can google up on the NHSTA website.
Which is why I asked if you were sure.
Because I don't think you can possibly be sure. But you say you are, so say why you're sure.
Ah, I misunderstood what you were asking; No I am not sure. I made my assessment based on what is available. If I'm proven wrong when Tesla either releases the data or more likely is forced to release the data by NHTSA, then I will stand corrected.
Lower fatalities is a function of the driver type, not of the car.