598
Wake-up Call: Democrats could easily lose the White House and Senate next year
(www.businessinsider.com)
this post was submitted on 20 Nov 2023
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politics
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I'm not voting for biden again. I don't care what you say.
He is simply a more skilled fascist than trump. He cut a check to Israel so fast with a smile on his face.
people voting for dems again: have fun spewing the same circular logic about how I have to vote for the lesser of two super evils dude, EVERY SINGLE election.
Y'all are more dangerous to democracy than trump supporters.
If the choices are Biden and Trump, and your single issue is Israel... well... you don't really HAVE a choice, do you? You'd have to not vote at all.
https://thehill.com/homenews/campaign/4259234-trump-i-fought-for-israel-like-no-president-ever-before/
Or maybe... just maybe... find a different issue to vote on:
https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/live/2023/nov/21/trump-2024-election-republicans-biden-politics-latest-updates
I'm not a single issue voter. But I will not support the genocide with my vote.
I'm also burned when biden completely failed to get student loans support passed.
Exactly that's why I'm not participateing!
You're a fool to keep playing a rigged game simply because it the only one in the cabinet.
I'll try to make it simple for you:
Voting for Trump isn't an option.
Not voting is the same as voting for Trump.
Republicans only win through reduced voter participation.
If Trump is elected again, that will be the end of the United States:
https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2023/aug/30/trump-interview-jail-political-opponents-glenn-beck
https://ny1.com/nyc/all-boroughs/news/2023/11/13/trump-hitler-vermin-nazi-biden
There are larger issues at stake in the '24 election than what Israel is doing or how your student loans get paid.
I realize you, personally, don't care. This is directed at anyone else coming into this thread and not realizing the stakes.
Ummmmm.... Is this you:
I feel like care more than you do. You're the one writing off the genocide. You going to choose the SAME guy who cut checks to Israel.
Lmao.
Projection much?
The choices are Biden and Trump, one of them will be the next President.
BOTH of them are in the pocket of Israel, so that is not a deciding factor.
Trump wanting to set the Constitution on fire and Biden wanting to preserve and protect it IS my deciding factor.
This is because people like you keep voting blue every time regardless of how bad they are.
If all the people who voted lesser would vote 3rd party the outcome might be different.
Right now you are ensuring nothing will change.
No, it's because no 3rd party is able to gain even the slightest interest among the wider electorate. They are called "fringe" candidates for a reason.
Perot in '92 was the most successful, didn't even hit 20% and won 0 states.
So, again, your choices are one candidate who admits to wanting to burn everything down, and one who doesn't.
The choice is easy.
By allowing Trump to win you are effectively voting for an even bigger genocide.
The genocide is ongoing under the biden administration!!!!
Better than trump is still fucking awful. And I don't support it.
Maybe if all the people here telling me too vote biden, didn't . and instead supported better independent candidates, we really could have change.
But your going to do the same thing we have been doing for decades, and insist I do the same.
So you're going to allow Trump to make it a bigger genocide?
That would be really great, but that's a fantasy. The reality is that we are stuck with a two party system.
I'm insisting that we prevent things from getting worse, and in the background we fix our two party system.
Meanwhile you're insisting an option that makes things as terrible as possible, as genocidal as possible.
You are the reason we are stuck in the two party system. You refuse to vote any other way. Lol
Do you not see the fallacy here?
The genocide is happening when I voted blue jackass. Its happening now. Under the dems.
You voted for the genocide supplier and your telling me we all need to do it again.
No, it's an inherent, mathematical bias of the system.
You're the one supporting Trump, the guy quoting Hitler.
No.
YOU are here telling people not to vote 3rd party............because 3rd party candidates dont get enough votes.
Do you see how that's a logical fallacy.
You are actively helping to create the problem........while say that the problem.......... is the reason you are creating the problem.
If you and a bunch of people who think like you , started to vote differently it might not be always " lesser of two evils"
If you voted 3rd party, 3rd party might get enough votes.......
But you are here telling everyone not to vote 3rd party.
As much as biden would have you believe, a vote against him is not a vote for trump. And i don't care how many times you say it.
we can stop, no one is going to call me a trump supporter just to coerce me into voting for their candidate. You are a Genocide apologist. And you can go fuck yourself.
I'm saying don't vote 3rd party because it splits the vote. That's the inherent flaw with the current system.
It may not literally be a vote for Trump, but in effect it is. The boomers who vote for Trump are the most reliably voting bloc out there. They WILL be voting for Trump next election.
And standing idly by makes you complicit.
so what's your solution?
not voting at all and just indirectly let trump win?
because his supporters are going to vote anyways
2016 called they want their democrat guilt trip back.
Roe v wade was over turned when dems were in office.
At their best they are worthless, at their worst, they are the same crypto-fasicts as the right with better PR.
I will vote for a candidate that has a platform I can support. If there are none I will not vote.
Have you never heard the term "delayed consequences"?
It's the republican SCOTUS that killed Roe.
That is effectively a vote for Trump, who will make the Palestinian genocide bigger. Blood will be on your hands.
Have you? Dems and repubs switch control back and forth constantly. We still have genocide supply, abortion bans, no functional student debt relief.
What if every person telling me to vote the lesser of two evils, voted independent?
The SCOTUS is republican though. The republican SCOTUS killed Roe. Have you been living under a rock?
"What if the sky turned purple?"
The sky is not going to magically turn purple.
"What if the sky turned purple?"
The sky is not going to magically turn purple.
Lol. But YOU are the person telling me to vote lesser of Two evils.
YOU are the one refusing to change for the better. You and a bunch of people who think like you.
Im gonna spell it out for you because it seems you are having trouble.
You're the problem. you are the reason 3rd party candidates don't get enough votes. Because YOU dont vote for them and tell other people not too vote 3rd party.
Am i being clear?
I don't see how that has any relevance to my pointing out how ridiculous the "what if everybody suddenly changed their behavior and did X".
You're the one abstaining from voting, therefore refusing to help make change happen.
I on the other hand am voting for candidates willing to bring election reform to fix the two party system issue.
It's an inherent bias in the FPTP election system we have. I'm not responsible for the inherent mathematical behavioral flaw in the system I never agreed to or created.
You're being clear. I understand perfectly well what you're saying. But you're failing to understand how emergent behavior works.
ah, this reminds me of the problem with voting https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PaxVCsnox_4
Every single election is biased towards a two party system. It's not circular logic, it is an inherent bias/flaw of our election system.
Until we get election reform we're stuck voting for the lesser of two evils, which is Biden. Biden is bad, but Trump is worse AND criminal.
Last I checked, Biden voters never tried to overthrow an election.
And the solution is too keep doing the same thing we do every election cycle? You realize this is the circular logic in was reffering too.
No they just support a genocide supplier and act like its the moral high ground.
The most biden and the dems will ever do is the smallest incremental change that they can advertise to chumps like you.
And while they do this they openly support war crimes around the world.
No, the solution is to vote in primaries for candidates that will move us towards STAR/approval voting, and that will get money out of politics.
The stopgap bandaid solution is to vote for the lesser of two evils. We're stuck with this bandaid until we get election reform.
Smallest incremental change + war crime support is better than active regression + war crime support.
Like I said in a separate comment, I'd rather vote for Biden than live in Gilead.
No its war crimes with extra steps.
Your options are:
War crime party + incrementally better change at best, floundering at worst
Extra war crime party + active regression/movement towards a Gilead-esc state + destruction of democracy
Throw away your vote
The choice seems pretty obvious to me.
I threw my vote away when I voted for biden. I got exactly zero of the things I wanted. And an extra genocide supply on the side.
Not to mention roe v wade got overturned. But that's totally different because the dems are.... Powerless to make real change? or even to keep things from sliding back?
But I should keep voting for them Because.....they are also powerless to stop trump? Lmao.
It's better to not get the things you want than to get fucked by Trump destroying everything.
You are really misinformed. Roe got overturned directly as a result of republicans getting voted into power. Trump had a shit load of judicial appointments, including 3 SCOTUS appointments.
The appointment Biden got was only able to maintain the status quo instead of making things worse.
You're literally blaming the democrats for the republican's evil actions.
Both parties are culpable, they switch back and forth in control and nothing actually changes.
Democrats are completely unable to stop republicans evil action. They are worthless or accomplices or both.
You can vote anyway you like, but the fact of the matter is that our fptp voting system is naturally going to trend towards two parties, and so we're stuck with a certain game theory.
If you want to change the system, that happens at the grassroot level, where then you work up to change the system. Trying to start with the president is just ridiculously naive.
And thinking that people who recognize the threat of trump and also understand how the system works are actually the bigger threat than the people actively attempting to elect a fascist...well, fuck, dude. I don't even know what to say to such stupidity.
This is all the same shit they said in 2016.
You are a stupid for falling into the same trap 7 years later.
The game is rigged. There are no good candidates. Stop voting for them.
You're telling me how to change the system because you know for a fact that the dems are worthless. Lmao.
I don't even know what to say to such stupidity.
If so, "they" were right then, as Trump openly refused to concede power when he lost, and lied so much that his cultists rose up and attacked the capitol in an attempt to overturn an election. It was an attempted coup.
I agree the game is rigged. However, the problem is that you're short-sighted and don't understand how changes like this happen. They don't happen from the top-down, but the bottom up. You're yelling into the void if you think "I'm not voting for one of the two parties!" does anything at all.
Yes, by saying "if you want to change the system" I was clearly saying the dems are worthless. You're a true genius. You must be doing quite well in life.
No they weren't. I voted blue. Biden got elected, and then he supplied the ongoing genocide. That is not a win. That is just the same abhorrent outcome that is completely unacceptable.
I would say the same thing about you. You are the one who is insisting we continue to use the bandaid, aka voting for the lesser.