You understand that you can still have anarchy without collectivism right? It's just called lawlessness, and when that happens, men with guns take what they want. Literally just look at any period of political instability in pretty much any country for just about all of history. What stops our current society from devolving into that if anarchic revolution were to occur?

Also, I'm not reading the book you linked. If there's relevant information, feel free to point out which paragraph/section.

[–] furysama@mastodon.straylight.engineering 0 points 11 months ago (3 children)

@GiveMemes that's what current society is. You just happen to be on the side of the men with guns

[–] GiveMemes@jlai.lu 1 points 11 months ago* (last edited 11 months ago) (2 children)

It really isn't. There's reasons that we've created laws and it's because the vast majority can't be expected to do the right thing just because it's the right thing and this isn't a one time thing, this is the entirety of history. I'm not "on the side of the men with guns" just for pointing out the obvious issue with the utopia, just as I'm not a neo-liberal capitalist for pointing out the inherent issues with the communist utopia or a dirty commie for pointing out the obvious issued with a capitalist utopia.

As it turns out, when you just talk about something and don't actually encounter the hardships of reality, all the ideas are amazing and fantastic lol. In an anarchic society you would be killed, enslaved, or raped. Human society hasn't come to the point yet where we could transition to such an idea without those problems.

[–] furysama@mastodon.straylight.engineering 1 points 11 months ago (1 children)

@GiveMemes you're misunderstanding me. I'm not saying you're on the side of the men with guns because you're asking questions about anarchy. I'm saying that because you literally live in a world whose status quo is enforced by violence, and you are advocating for the institutions which enforce that status quo as necessary.

[–] GiveMemes@jlai.lu 1 points 11 months ago

Every status quo is enforced by violence. That's kinda why we pursue utopian ideals is to minimize said violence. Shoot for the moon, land among the stars kinda thing.

An actual anarchist revolution would just lead to more violence tho without significant changes to our culture. Hatred, tribalism, and fear are all innate to humans. The question is how we overcome those base feelings in order to form a better society.

Anybody can give you a better society than the one that exists. It's exceedingly easy. The trick is to make it actually work.

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