this post was submitted on 10 Aug 2023
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Communism

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[–] bloodfart@lemmy.ml 2 points 1 year ago (1 children)

The cias own data on the ddr disproves this.

[–] Devilsadvocate@reddthat.com 0 points 1 year ago (1 children)

Oh I mean we can trust the cia, sure.

Lemme see a link :)

[–] bloodfart@lemmy.ml 1 points 1 year ago (1 children)

the classic

Who knows why they released it. It was averaged across all Soviet citizens, not just the ddr.

[–] Devilsadvocate@reddthat.com 0 points 1 year ago (1 children)

I mean this is just for the ssr, which is by far the most successful example of a communist power.

But most current and past communist countries famously have famines.

[–] bloodfart@lemmy.ml 2 points 1 year ago (2 children)

I’m almost 100% that it was an average but even so. May I see the famines?

[–] Devilsadvocate@reddthat.com 0 points 1 year ago (1 children)

The whole doc is talking about the caloric intake of a Soviet citizen

[–] bloodfart@lemmy.ml 2 points 1 year ago

That’s what made me think it was across the whole Soviet Union. The cia was usually pretty specific about what particular soviet they meant because their data would be used in operations against those particular states.

[–] Devilsadvocate@reddthat.com 0 points 1 year ago* (last edited 1 year ago) (1 children)
[–] bloodfart@lemmy.ml 2 points 1 year ago (1 children)

So two from checks notes 80 years ago in regions that experienced famine every 10 years and never experienced famine again, one literally caused by a us blockade and one caused by a us blockade and a catastrophic flood that hit 30% of the country.

When I get back to the computer we can compare that to the famines experienced by capitalist countries during the same period.

Regardless, the suggestion that communism is somehow fundamentally bound to malnutrition is ahistorical.

[–] Devilsadvocate@reddthat.com 1 points 1 year ago (1 children)

Yeah that’s true, but i never said that it’s fundamentally bound. Just that communist countries have a high amount of famines.

The proportion of number of communist countries to famines in those countries is higher than that of capitalist countries to famines in those countries.

[–] bloodfart@lemmy.ml 1 points 1 year ago (1 children)

Africa alone has enough capitalist countries (imperial holdings) with famines over the same time period to disprove that. then we can start talking about bengal and ireland.

communist countries don't have more famines than capitalist ones.

[–] Devilsadvocate@reddthat.com 1 points 1 year ago (1 children)
[–] bloodfart@lemmy.ml 1 points 1 year ago* (last edited 1 year ago)

okay, you want links to prove that capitalist famines in africa outnumber communist famines in the whole world over the same time period:

Wikipedia article on "famine", section "africa"

i'll just summarize from that one section:

famine in the congo caused by belgians

the rinderpest virus

belgians taking grain in rwanda during ww2

the british made malawi pay for food aid for a famine british administrators created through mismanagement

famine in karamoja, uganda brought on by instability in the region (wonder what made it unstable... oh well, resuming patrol)

The tigray famine in ethiopia and then the 83-85 one with live aid as the cherry on top showing that not only does capitalism create and exacerbate the conditions for famine but also can't respond to one when it's ostensibly trying.

somalia 92' came from conditions directly created by global capital

and if those few, i know i'm leaving so much information out, aren't enough it is the explicit policy of the IMF and world bank to make countries dependent on food imports.

and that's just a brief summary from the broadest overview (often minimized with language that suggests these are somehow the fault of the victims) page on shitty ol' wikipedia. imagine what a real survey of the history from primary sources would turn up!