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Russia was going to take Kyiv in 3 days. Now it’s installing concrete shelters at home
(www.politico.eu)
this post was submitted on 22 Aug 2024
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Not too long ago, a Tankie demanded I find a quote of Putin saying the three days thing. As if he had to say it in some sort of press conference for pretty much the entire military leadership of Russia to say similar shit.
Putin technically never said it. Just a lot of his allies and media people did.
Not that it really matters in the end. Russia was quite sure to take the country in less than a week and failed misserably
To be fair, I listened to a lot of military analysts that studied the first few days of the war and Russia was really fucking close to decapitating Kyiv. Ukraine just came in clutch in the crucial moments, Zelensky survived multiple assasination attempts, Ukranian forces prevented the taking of the Hostomel airport, and Ukranian forces were forward deployed (without having being given orders) prevented attacks into the city. Any one of those failed and Russia could have actually taken Kyiv in a couple weeks.
The best story I read about the defence of Hostomel was that UAF was handing out weapons to civilians in order to defend the airport.
Wow.
Somebody just drops south park bits without understanding the context.
They were not that close, they just drove in from Belarus and dropped some paratroopers with no support. That's a good strategy for losing your best troops.
They also didn't use a few days of bombing to soften up the targets. Ukraine was surprised but all of their equipment was intact. That's like number one in any attack plan.
They basically underestimated the Ukrainians and thought they would just run away. Those paratroopers were very good but they are only scary to local police, not to a trained military. Without heavy support, they were sitting ducks at the airport.
I’d be careful with these analysts, they’re mainly in the self-promoting business so they make up the most dramatic stories to sell themselves to the media.
Michale Kaufman, Dimitri Alperovich, both people who have visited the front and are in contact with Ukraine officials. Center for Urban Warfare Studies, run by someone in the army. And veterans who were there. They are not random youtubers.
Manafort also visited Ukraine, so you now have to to believe everything he says.🙄
Don’t be such a sucker. Don’t be so endlessly impressed by people.
Is it safe to say that Zelensky is a total badass at this point? (And throughout the past 3 years)
And it's also a famously common mistake. WWI initially had a bunch of countries happily go to a quick and decisive little war.
Hell I remember Cheney (or was it rumsfelt) in 2003 talking about how Iraq would be ready for America to pull out within a year.
They'll always be home by Christmas.
Nah, there's leaked emails of FSB feeding Putin the info that they could take Kyiv in 3 days.
Exactly. he didn't have to say it.
The tankies love demanding proof.
And generally they want proof that one specific thing literally happened when that isn't really the issue.
"Oh yeah? Quote Xi Jinping saying he doesn't like being compared to Winnie the Pooh!"
.... dunno if there's a quote of it. but like... Winnie is one of the most heavily censored things in china.
Which is funny. Because Pooh is cute, and aside from being a bit daft, isn't particularly offensive. Now... Erdogan has it bad. he Keeps having to have people arrested for being compared to gollum.
We always have that video of Erdogan getting kicked in the nuts by that horse, at least
I’m gonna need a link on that.
You know. For, uhm, a study on internet censorship.
Also, uhm, anyone know a good AI to change Someone’s voice into a high pitched gollum voice….
…. Asking for a friend….
Got you
Oh that’s even better than I imagined.
Right. That's what I'm saying. They demand proof of something that you don't need to bother proving because that specific thing does not matter.
Yeah because Winnie the Pooh is an American propaganda machine. Show me a quote of xi jumping saying that it is because he doesn't like being compared to a cartoon bear!
(I'm cosplaying as a lemmy.ml)
Can't be a big bad dictator while being compared to a silly cartoon bear. Compare Tim Walz to Winnie the Poo, and he'd probably run with it.
Damn, if this is China's idea of heavily censored, they must have the most free and open society in the world.
Bro, there are people in a local groupchat that think the great leap forward was a good thing and are self-proclaimed history buffs obsessed with the years 1939-1945, specifically in Russia and China.
They harken back to it as a better time, not realizing the irony of it while being a queer American. It's exquisitely painful to watch 💀
I always confront those people with "and what do you think would happen to YOU in such a place? History doesn't think it will be good" but then they double down or make some mental gymnastic leap to why it's okay.
Surely the leopards won't eat THEIR face.
I mean the west was sterilizing and imprisoning gay people around that time. Communist countries tend to be way more progressive.
Neither was great, as written about by David K. Johnson in The Lavender Scare: The Cold War Persecution of Gays and Lesbians in the Federal Government. That said, having read much about this time period and the history of the early gay rights movement in the US, I would pick the US any day of the week over the nonexistent gay rights movement in Russia and many other communist countries, who still give people like me the cold shoulder.
Still, forming a gay civil rights group in 1948 was a progressive step in the right direction (the Mattachine Society), and the leaders paved the way for the more well known gay rights movement in the 1970s. They walked so our ancestors could run.
Russia hasn't been communist for almost 35 years.
There's gay rights groups in communist countries too. They tend to take different forms though, due to different cultures and circumstances; you don't have to form protection groups if you're not in danger of getting hate-crime'd.
In China for instance, they're more focused on gaining familial acceptance than government persecution. In Cuba, they had a referendum to enshrine LGBT+ rights in the constitution.
And then proof does not come from a Tankie Wiki or a blatant APT run website - "lol fucking fake disinfor libtard".
It's not like they'll believe it anyway.
Sometimes of the most trivial things.
A conservative once asked me for proof that bikes have a lower co2 manufacturing footprint than a car. It's funny how they tend to share tactics.
They aren't, but if you're unable to produce a peer reviewed study showing this, then you "lose" the argument. And even then, it's probably the result of Marxist college indoctrination.
It's pure sophistry. It's taking the form of a rational argument while strangling its purpose.
LOL. Let me go ahead and apply for a grant to get that study done for you.
Sea lions gotta sealion.
Sea lioning, for those curious what it's called.
I had no idea it had a name. Good to know.
Can you back up this claim..?
Didn't they March in with victory day parade attire in their backpacks instead of a second round of ammunition, or rations?
Said or unsaid, even if the war was going exactly as planned, it's a shit war that's executed poorly and will destroy the Russian economy and likely end up losing everything they took, even Crimea.
If all the joint chiefs and secretaries of [thing] said "we will be marching in Ottowa in 3 days" it really doesn't matter if the president said it. Because even if he hasn't said it in a press conference to the world, he most certainly agrees with the people who DO think it's a slam dunk.
I'm sure anything you said or linked would have been met with "that's western propaganda" like they're not shaking hands with MAGAts screeching fake news at things they don't like.
Show me where the entire Russian military leadership was saying similar shit.
And like clockwork, they show up from lemmy.ml.