this post was submitted on 04 Nov 2024

158 points (92.9% liked)

News

23367 readers

3960 users here now

Welcome to the News community!

Rules:

1. Be civil

Attack the argument, not the person. No racism/sexism/bigotry. Good faith argumentation only. This includes accusing another user of being a bot or paid actor. Trolling is uncivil and is grounds for removal and/or a community ban. Do not respond to rule-breaking content; report it and move on.

2. All posts should contain a source (url) that is as reliable and unbiased as possible and must only contain one link.

Obvious right or left wing sources will be removed at the mods discretion. We have an actively updated blocklist, which you can see here: https://lemmy.world/post/2246130 if you feel like any website is missing, contact the mods. Supporting links can be added in comments or posted seperately but not to the post body.

3. No bots, spam or self-promotion.

Only approved bots, which follow the guidelines for bots set by the instance, are allowed.

4. Post titles should be the same as the article used as source.

Posts which titles don’t match the source won’t be removed, but the autoMod will notify you, and if your title misrepresents the original article, the post will be deleted. If the site changed their headline, the bot might still contact you, just ignore it, we won’t delete your post.

5. Only recent news is allowed.

Posts must be news from the most recent 30 days.

6. All posts must be news articles.

No opinion pieces, Listicles, editorials or celebrity gossip is allowed. All posts will be judged on a case-by-case basis.

7. No duplicate posts.

If a source you used was already posted by someone else, the autoMod will leave a message. Please remove your post if the autoMod is correct. If the post that matches your post is very old, we refer you to rule 5.

8. Misinformation is prohibited.

Misinformation / propaganda is strictly prohibited. Any comment or post containing or linking to misinformation will be removed. If you feel that your post has been removed in error, credible sources must be provided.

9. No link shorteners.

The auto mod will contact you if a link shortener is detected, please delete your post if they are right.

10. Don't copy entire article in your post body

For copyright reasons, you are not allowed to copy an entire article into your post body. This is an instance wide rule, that is strictly enforced in this community.

founded 1 year ago

MODERATORS

rjc@lemmy.world

Thekingoflorda@lemmy.world

Tenthrow@lemmy.world

JonsJava@lemmy.world

gedaliyah@lemmy.world

little_cow@lemmy.world

jeffw@lemmy.world

enu@lemmy.world

158

That “Little Secret” Between Trump and Johnson? Here’s What It Could Mean. (www.thenation.com)

submitted 2 weeks ago by CurlyWurlies4All to c/news@lemmy.world

32 comments fedilink hide all child comments

all 33 comments

sorted by: hot top controversial new old

[–] xenomor@lemmy.world 30 points 2 weeks ago (1 children)

JFC this may be the most depressing thing I’ve ever read.

[–] TrickDacy@lemmy.world 22 points 2 weeks ago (2 children)

I feel similarly. The both sidesers won't care though. They'll just mumble something about genocide so they can pretend there's no difference in the parties

[–] InverseParallax@lemmy.world 3 points 2 weeks ago (2 children)

The genocide argument goes away in 2 days, so we have that to look forward to.

[–] phdepressed@sh.itjust.works 3 points 2 weeks ago (1 children)

Harris came out hard against Israel's genocide today. Argument already moot.

[–] distantsounds@lemmy.world -1 points 2 weeks ago (1 children)

No she didn’t. She’s just saying the same thing since the convention. It would be nice if she would commit to following US law and state there will be a halt to the weapon shipments

[–] skulblaka@sh.itjust.works 2 points 2 weeks ago

Then you want to be upset with the Republican held House of Representatives who drafted a bill to prevent this when Biden tried to do it the first time, explicitly going against established US law and also illegally withholding salary from any government official who tries to challenge it.

Here's the bill which has already passed in the House, voted Yea by 208 Republicans (3 nay, 6 abstaining) and voted Nay by 184 Democrats (16 Yea, 13 abstain).

Here's the vote tally if you'd like to write some letters about it to your local representatives.

[+] CmdrShepard42@lemm.ee -17 points 2 weeks ago (3 children)

Imagine treating an ethnic cleansing that we're funding and arming as 'annoying election rhetoric' on your social media feed and then wondering why people equate you with the right...

[–] InverseParallax@lemmy.world 4 points 2 weeks ago (1 children)

And in 2 days nobody will care anymore, just like the immigrant caravan or half the other issues that only show up before elections.

I'm perfectly fine with a rational debate about the issue, this is just stridency to disrupt any debate.

[–] CmdrShepard42@lemm.ee 1 points 2 weeks ago (1 children)

The migrant caravan was completely made up. The slaughter in Gaza has been happening for over a year with tens of thousands of innocent people blown to pieces and burned alive. Your opinion is disgusting and I see no reason to discuss with you any further.

[–] InverseParallax@lemmy.world 0 points 2 weeks ago

And both will disappear tomorrow.

The suits decide what we care about day to day, and you're falling for it.

[–] rusticus@lemm.ee 2 points 2 weeks ago

Imagine thinking both sides are the same on Israel/Gaza.

[–] 418_im_a_teapot@sh.itjust.works 1 points 2 weeks ago

Do you really think you’re going to get a more favorable result under Trump than under Harris? They are both likely to continue supporting Israel – Harris for political reasons and Trump because Israel can easily funnel money into his businesses to effectively bribe him.

So logically, if the result is identical either way, it becomes a non-issue in terms of who you vote for. You have to look to other issues in which there is actual differentiation in order to determine the best candidate.

Any sane person knows genocide is awful and would love a candidate who is willing to stand up to Israel. Any logical person recognizes that we don’t have that luxury and must therefore cast our votes based on other critical factors, of which there are plenty.

Supporting Harris does not equate to supporting Israel or their genocide.

[+] CmdrShepard42@lemm.ee -22 points 2 weeks ago (2 children)

Ah yes blame the people that won't submit to tribalism and want to hold our politicians to a higher standard than "slightly less worse than the other guy" and feel smug in the knowledge that the people you're defending, who have allowed all this to happen under their watch, have brought us to the point where our votes are completely meaningless. Good job, buddy. You got what you wanted.

[–] 418_im_a_teapot@sh.itjust.works 13 points 2 weeks ago (1 children)

You have two choices. There’s nothing anyone can do about that in the next 48 hours. If you refuse to vote for the “lesser evil” because of your “higher standards,” you end up with the greater evil. And in four years you might not get a choice at all.

Shove your standards up your ass and vote using logic instead of emotion.

[+] CmdrShepard42@lemm.ee -7 points 2 weeks ago (2 children)

Shove your standards up your ass and vote using logic instead of emotion

And that's precisely why this country is so fucked. Neither party is accountable to the electorate because of people like you with this mentality. Both have contributed to the position we're in now and have zero reason to actually fix anything because theyre both guaranteed to retain power. You're just perpetuating the status quo with your faulty 'logic' of doing absolutely nothing other than attacking anyone who speaks out against this insanity and rewarding those who perpetuate it.

[–] 418_im_a_teapot@sh.itjust.works 3 points 2 weeks ago

Neither party is accountable to the electorate because of people like you with this mentality.

Wrong. We’re here because the electoral college gives Wyoming voters 400% more weight than California voters; because of gerrymandering and the cap on the number of representatives in the House; and because of a FPTP system that always results in two-party rule. My “mentality” isn’t going to magically change that.

Both … have zero reason to actually fix anything because theyre [sic] both guaranteed to retain power.

Ok, so yet again you can’t compare two things that are the same to make a decision. You have to use different criteria in order to tip the scale one way or the other.

doing absolutely nothing other than attacking anyone who speaks out against this insanity and rewarding those who perpetuate it.

And you think your emotional pleas on the internet are somehow making a difference? You think not voting will send some sort of message?

You have no strategy beyond making angry comments. I, on the other hand, casted my vote for ranked choice voting in my state, which will help third party candidates have a greater chance of winning state elections. I voted previously for a new method of dividing districts that avoids gerrymandering by any one party, and it passed. And I voted for the presidential candidate who believes in science and reality over the one who thinks windmills cause cancer. I’m making my vote count for the critical issues that underly the problems we face. I don’t get my way on every single issue, but that’s how democracy works.

If you want to throw away your vote, that’s your choice. But don’t act like it’s some morally superior act when in reality you’re not making any difference and you'll just end up with the worst outcome instead of the less desirable outcome.

[–] CileTheSane@lemmy.ca 2 points 2 weeks ago (1 children)

And in 3 days we will suddenly stop hearing from CmdrShepard42 about holding politicians accountable.

[–] CmdrShepard42@lemm.ee 0 points 2 weeks ago (1 children)

Based on what exactly?

[–] CileTheSane@lemmy.ca 0 points 2 weeks ago (1 children)

Based on the fact that for some reason it is only once every 4 years, around October, that there appears to be an interest in a 3rd party from Americans...

[–] CmdrShepard42@lemm.ee 0 points 2 weeks ago (1 children)

And the rest of the time over the last 50 years, everyone is happy with the government's performance? What a ridiculous argument rooted in absolutely nothing. This says a lot more about you than anyone else.

Maybe this is the only period where you hear people criticizing these two private organizations that run the show because it's the only time you ever take your head out from between their cheeks to get some air?

[–] CileTheSane@lemmy.ca 0 points 2 weeks ago (1 children)

So a week from now you're still going to be posting about the importance of holding politicians accountable? Come January you're going to be involved in some action to pressure the government to do something about Israel? I'd love to be proven wrong.

[–] CmdrShepard42@lemm.ee 0 points 2 weeks ago (2 children)

These comments reek of projection because your view of politics is "pay attention in October before the election." You don't seem to grasp that other people care about how the country is run outside of that tiny window where you pay attention because you only see the world through your own lens.

[–] CileTheSane@lemmy.ca 1 points 6 days ago (1 children)

Look at that, a week later and no posts about holding politicians accountable.

So tell me, what is the plan to hold Trump accountable?

[–] CmdrShepard42@lemm.ee 1 points 2 days ago (1 children)

I've had numerous back and forths with people about holding the DNC responsible for losing the election since it ended. What are you talking about?

[–] CileTheSane@lemmy.ca 1 points 2 days ago (1 children)

Yes yes, the DNC has already lost. You've won that battle.

Now that you have, what is the plan to hold Republicans accountable?

[–] CmdrShepard42@lemm.ee 1 points 1 day ago (1 children)

So now that the DNC predicably lost by running terrible neoliberal candidates like people were warned about and refused to acknowledge, you think it's now on me to reign in the Republican party? What a joke that people who refused to listen to reason and dug their heals in on failed strategies now want to make the messenger responsible for fixing their mess.

The DNC was our chance to hold them accountable, but they preferred to abandon their base and run on a platform of right-wing ideals and lost their opportunity to do so. We can now either form a new party that represents the left and try to make inroads in 2026 or blast the shit out of all the neoliberals in the DNC for the next two years (and beyond) until they expel these fake leftists from the party and maybe they'll start winning elections again.

[–] CileTheSane@lemmy.ca 1 points 1 day ago

you think it’s now on me to reign in the Republican party?

It was apparently on you to reign in the Democratic Party. What a joke that the Democratic Party needs to be perfect or else you'll refuse to vote for them, but the Republican Party can do whatever they want and suddenly it's not your problem. That’s precisely why the country is so fucked, nobody holds the Republicans accountable. Their voters don't care, and the people who disagree with them are too busy "holding the Democrats accountable" to fucking hold the Republicans accountable.

The DNC was our chance to hold them accountable

Correct, and you argued strongly that people should not do so. So now what? Sure, make a plan for a better party in 2026, but that's 2 years away. What is the plan to hold Republicans accountable this coming year when they start fucking things up by denying aid to Ukraine, giving Israel more weapons and free reign to use them however they want, pass laws specifically to push hatred against vulnerable communities, and ban life saving abortions at a federal level?

You've succeeded. You got what you wanted. The country is getting fucked up now and now you want to shrug your shoulders and say "Not my problem, I'll be back to argue against doing anything about it in 2 years"?

[–] CileTheSane@lemmy.ca 1 points 2 weeks ago

I don't live in the US, so I'm not terribly involved in your local politics. I just notice that it only seems to be in October that a noticeable number of people are talking about holding politicians accountable and "making a 3rd party viable."

Prove me wrong and push for improvements between elections as well.

[–] TrickDacy@lemmy.world 0 points 2 weeks ago

Just because your tribe is less popular doesn't absolve it of its thought prevention. You decide everything bad and then just follow the other sheep to the slaughter

[–] d00phy@lemmy.world 12 points 2 weeks ago* (last edited 2 weeks ago) (1 children)

A really overthought “solution” that could’ve only come from a room of politicians. I mean, your made-up “equity election” didn’t work, so you have another set of elected officials further remove selection of this powerful, even then, position from the people instead of just failing back to the popular count. Fucking lawyers.

[–] DirkMcCallahan@lemmy.world 9 points 2 weeks ago

Absolutely horrifying. And very, very plausible.

[–] MimicJar@lemmy.world 1 points 2 weeks ago

The new House isn’t sworn in until January 3... By the time we get to January 6, the electors are supposed to have voted. December 11 is the deadline for appointing electors, December 25 the deadline for voting. Mike Johnson will still be in charge on both of those days.

Since we're not playing by the rules anymore, could the new house speaker (assuming Democratic majority) just extend/accept things on Jan 3rd?

Since we'll know that sooner they would just need to signal that they intend to accept late appointments and voting.

I suppose that too would go to the Supreme Court, but it seems worth trying.