this post was submitted on 16 Aug 2023
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Google search is over (mastodon.social)
submitted 1 year ago* (last edited 1 year ago) by JoBo@feddit.uk to c/technology@lemmy.world
 

Via @rodhilton@mastodon.social

Right now if you search for "country in Africa that starts with the letter K":

  • DuckDuckGo will link to an alphabetical list of countries in Africa which includes Kenya.

  • Google, as the first hit, links to a ChatGPT transcript where it claims that there are none, and summarizes to say the same.

This is because ChatGPT at some point ingested this popular joke:

"There are no countries in Africa that start with K." "What about Kenya?" "Kenya suck deez nuts?"

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[–] eager_eagle@lemmy.world 147 points 1 year ago (11 children)

when will people learn that search results change all the time and are different for different people

[–] Sami@lemmy.zip 134 points 1 year ago (11 children)

I get the same as the main post. Either way the point still stands. I had someone correct me with a misconception about something because he googled it and thats what it said in the answer box. It's getting increasingly difficult to rely on search results especially when google synthesizes them into questions and answers with little context

[–] cybervseas@lemmy.world 56 points 1 year ago

Yes. I have to keep reminding my parents that those little Google answer boxes aren't real search results and can't be trusted. They sometimes say the exact opposite of the page they're citing!

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[–] Neato@kbin.social 49 points 1 year ago

It doesn't matter? If you search for something and you get a blatantly wrong answer parroted from an AI text completion service, it's still a fail.

I got the wrong answer from Google just now and I've never heard of that joke before. So clearly it isn't just OP with polluted metrics.

[–] antonim@lemmy.dbzer0.com 21 points 1 year ago (1 children)

What's your point here? Is googling supposed to be a lottery of good and shit results?

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[–] madsen@lemmy.world 114 points 1 year ago (5 children)

Oh, this is great... And because the ChatGPT transcript is highly ranked on Google, it's almost certainly going to be used for training ChatGPT. A feedback loop of shitty information. Praise ChatGPT!

[–] MalReynolds 48 points 1 year ago (3 children)

Remember GIGO (Garbage In, Garbage Out). Due to years of SEO and content farming (which google profited from, so you get what you deserve assholes) most of the internet, by volume, is self-congratulatory, for profit, garbage, or, you know, reddit garbage. Hopefully someone points a large LLM at the library of congress or other large, well curated data source, but of course copyright will not allow, thanks mickey mouse. Wouldn't surprise me if the military is already on it, hopefully that leaks...

[–] tony@lemmy.hoyle.me.uk 23 points 1 year ago (1 children)

LLMs will eventually start feeding of search results from other LLMs and they'll just start regurgitating each others nonsense. If that isn't happening already.

Nobody is going to point an LLM at a good data source because that would mean spending money on actually useful stuff not fast cars and booze.

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[–] outdated_belated@lemmy.sdf.org 76 points 1 year ago (2 children)

The second-highest hit gives a clue as to why:

Relevantly to Lemmy’s existence in the first place, it suggests Reddit as a pretty pivotal training data source, which Reddit tries to cash in on while also killing 3rd party apps due to apathy

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[–] Rottcodd@literature.cafe 72 points 1 year ago (4 children)

I doubted this, so I tried it. I haven't used google for ages, so I first had to search "google" in DDG, then I went to the main page. When I started typing it in, it suggested the full text of the search, so I thought it was even less likely that it would work like the OP said - that even if it had been the case that it previously did that, so many people have self-evidently done that search that the results would now be correct.

But no - there it was, right at the top - "While there are 54 recognized countries in Africa, none of them begin with the letter "K". The closest is Kenya, which starts with a "K" sound, but is actually spelled with a "K" sound."

And with that, I'll contentedly go back to not using google.

[–] jigsaw250@lemmy.world 30 points 1 year ago

The closest is Kenya, which starts with a "K" sound, but is actually spelled with a "K" sound."

Not going to lie, that's pretty disturbing. This search engine is used by millions (maybe billions?) and they're providing false information to all those people. That's scary.

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[–] Vlhacs@reddthat.com 58 points 1 year ago* (last edited 1 year ago) (4 children)

Chatgpt creating incorrect feedback loops like this is one of my main concerns about AI being used so prevalently. This and original thoughts disappearing because every new content in the web is generated by AI and not by a human.

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[–] jwn@lemmy.world 58 points 1 year ago (3 children)
[–] UnknownQuantity@lemm.ee 14 points 1 year ago (2 children)

I typed in "what countries in Africa start with k" and got Kenya. When I tried your search term I got your result also. Weird.

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[–] owiseedoubleyou@lemmy.ml 56 points 1 year ago

Which starts with a "K" sound, but is actually spelled with a "K" sound

AI is truly magical

[–] Blackmist@feddit.uk 46 points 1 year ago (1 children)

AI generated content is pure search result pollution.

What Google should be doing rather than pushing Bard is detecting AI nonsense and purging it from their search database.

[–] diffuselight@lemmy.world 22 points 1 year ago (1 children)

You cannot detect AI generated content. Not with any real world accuracy and it will only get worse.

Also, because google relies on growth for everything from compensation structure to business model, they are in a bind - ads is not growing anymore, it’s done.

And while they managed to create an illusion of growth this earnings round by juicing subscription fees 20% and increasing ad load everywhere, it’s not a sustainable tactic. We are already seeing a tech sell off as people are getting less and less secure.

So they rely on AI narrative to keep investors invested Google needs AI to work or the investors will move it to a place that may offer higher returns than a squeezed out ads model.

Worse even they are being attacked by AI - on the quality front (junk content) and in the marketplace (openAI), they don’t have a choice but to take a pro AI stance.

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[–] MarkHughes4096@lemmy.world 43 points 1 year ago (2 children)

I actually stopped using google search all together last night, I was searching for something and the result where just abysmal and mostly irrelevant, I searched on DuckDuckGo and found much better results. I was using both, Google used to be so good and now it's just a mess.

[–] salient_one@lemmy.villa-straylight.social 22 points 1 year ago* (last edited 1 year ago) (2 children)

My biggest pain point with Duck is that the minus operator doesn't seem to do anything. Have to use Startpage (!s) when in need of excluding a word.

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[–] circuitfarmer@lemmy.sdf.org 31 points 1 year ago (3 children)

Surprised your first ten results weren't ads

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[–] regalia@literature.cafe 31 points 1 year ago (12 children)

Hmm, maybe AI won't replace search engines.

[–] sibbl@feddit.de 16 points 1 year ago (7 children)

This sounds like "Hmm, maybe calculators won't replace mathematicians." to me.

Not sure why it should replace them. They'll co-exist. Sometimes you can do the math in your brain and for other things you use calculators. Results of calculators can still be wrong it you don't use them properly.

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[–] adeoxymus@lemmy.world 30 points 1 year ago

Tbh the problem is not due to chat gpt but because Google doesn't rank search results by correctness but something that is related to popularity.

[–] Chatotorix@lemmy.world 29 points 1 year ago (1 children)

I tried and it is true here at least. Says Kenya is the closest but although it starts with a K sound, it's spelled with a K sound. lmao

The only time I tried ChatGPT for something that required a little bit of processing it failed miserably. I had a shower thought, "what is the most used noun on lyrics of this band I like?" I asked it and it gave me random words. I decided to investigate and ask it what are specific lyrics of some of the most popular songs and it kept telling me made up lyrics, when I could actually find them immediately on Google.

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[–] const_void@lemmy.ml 29 points 1 year ago (4 children)

Searched for 'office gym' on YouTube yesterday and it returned a bunch of videos of Jim from The Office. The enshittification is everywhere these days.

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[–] Synthead@lemmy.ml 26 points 1 year ago
[–] Clent@lemmy.world 25 points 1 year ago (3 children)

Constantly forgetting I changed all my default search engines to DuckDuckGo.

Went to Google to test this...what a trash website.

Pushed me to download the app.

Pops up a recommendation to download Chrome.

Has clutter on the default search search form.

Looks more like yahoo than the google of yore

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[–] fernandu00@lemmy.ml 25 points 1 year ago (6 children)

I've been using DDG for a year and like the search results but what bothers me is that you can't exclude a word from your query with minus sign!

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[–] menemen@lemmy.world 24 points 1 year ago* (last edited 1 year ago) (2 children)
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[–] Rusky_900@reddthat.com 23 points 1 year ago

I never got into DDG because Google was legitimately better. It seems that is no longer the case and I'm finding no reason to use it instead anymore.

[–] LaughingFox@lemmy.world 22 points 1 year ago (9 children)

Thanks to this post, I changed my search engine in Vivaldi to DuckDuckGo, and Edge uses Bing already, and I changed Mull's engine to Ecosia. Phew! Now I feel better.

Google when did you get so crummy?

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[–] readbeanicecream@kbin.social 22 points 1 year ago (5 children)

@JoBo I just googled it and Kenya came up as the first hit in Search and in Bard.

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[–] Sumea@lemmy.world 22 points 1 year ago

I tested this with my local google so not America, somewhere in Europe. "While there are 54 recognized countries in Africa, none of them begin with the letter "K". The closest is Kenya, which starts with a "K" sound, but is actually spelled with a "K" sound." I'd say this is worth a wot.

[–] radix@lemm.ee 20 points 1 year ago (2 children)

I didn't think it would work, because surely they'd patched it by now, but:

While there are 54 recognized countries in Africa, none of them begin with the letter "K". The closest is Kenya, which starts with a "K" sound, but is actually spelled with a "K" sound. It's always interesting to learn new trivia facts like this.

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[–] samus12345@sh.itjust.works 19 points 1 year ago (3 children)

When I googled "What countries in Africa start with a K", it gave the correct answer, but when I googled "Do any countries in Africa start with a K", it gave me the ChatGPT nonsense.

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[–] NeoNachtwaechter@lemmy.world 19 points 1 year ago

I could reproduce it exactly as described.

[–] hayalci@fstab.sh 16 points 1 year ago* (last edited 1 year ago) (2 children)

No need for using sensational/clickbait headlines like this.

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[–] dhork@lemmy.world 16 points 1 year ago

I saw it, it's marked as a "featured snippet", whatever that means....

[–] wieli99@sh.itjust.works 15 points 1 year ago (4 children)

Someone recommended Kagi here, and tho it isn't free, it's the only engine I've found so far that can legitimately consistently outperform google

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[–] exu@feditown.com 14 points 1 year ago

Kagi also links to an alphabetical list as first result. However, they also have a "quick answer" button using an LLM.

Quick Answer

The country in Africa that starts with the letter K is Kenya. [1] Kenya is located in East Africa and shares borders with Tanzania, Uganda, South Sudan, Ethiopia, and Somalia. [2]

Alphabetical List of All African Countries - ThoughtCo Countries beginning with K - Worldometer

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